advice reqd: fathers who have won custody of a child.
PT 2: BRAINWASHED KIDS, CRAZY MOTHER AND THE FC.
before my husband and i enter the fc AGAIN we need all the advice and support from any of the fathers out there who have won custody of their child/ren or maybe in the process of. ARE THERE ANY ??
I am the step-mother of boy 11 and girl 13, our plight started in 2005 with supervised then unsupervised day contact only, then moving into fortnight contact and half of all the school holidays.shared care is not possible being that ex lives in another town.hubby and i have had to fight all the way just to get contact and maintain it. throughout this, the mother has made it increasingly difficult (to say the least) to maintain a relationship with the kids. the ongoing brainwashing, manipulation and parental alienation is mind-boggling. as a mother of 6 (and happily going through contact with my ex for 6yrs) also raised a “whangai” and two nephew’s im disgusted that this female uses her own children as pawns, to voice her issues and hang-ups she has towards my husband. hubby separated from his ex in 2002 she left with the kids to another town. my husband and i met in 2003, he had not seen his children, we had a child in 2005 and 6 months later finally supervised contact took place, another battle took place in court to move into unsupervised contact “day contact” and yes! another battle, to move toward fortnight contact and half the holidays, hubby and i won them all but was it a fight! fortnight contact started in 2006.
things went along swimingly for 6 months. feb 2007 hubby and i made it legal and married ex was furious and problems occurred. ex was shacked up with partner and had been since 2006 but vigorously denied it ??? dont know why, maybe it was because she was in receipt of dpb and boyfriend had own home (of which they were living in) and own business, not to mention she has legal aid. Nov 2008 ex wants contact to cease,another court battle affidavits flying all over the show, a year passes and finally we had a date, last week, we received the judges decision “we won” yayy… contact remains!!
umm no sorry- lawyer for children has been instructed by boy 11 to appeal decision…wtf
without sounding like something out of the days of our lives i’ll leave it there. hubby and i are seriously contemplating challenging the mother for custody of boy 11 in order for us to do this we will need all the help we can get- this is unfamiliar territory to us and although we are confident our lawyer will do all she can, we feel we need to know first hand accounts of what we will be getting ourselves into.
i am thinking our main argument to be “phycological damage caused by the mother to the child” also the children have never had the chance to form a strong relationship with their father, the mother being the main hindrance for it, we believe the longer boy 11 stays in her care, runs a risk of more damage being done to him mentally.
i must send a great big thankyou to “FATHERS OF NZ” without their advice, which i followed to the letter we would not of otherwise had a favorable outcome this time around. …thanks menz issue for making the link accessible.
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First what area of NZ are you in? Self representation is complex but can be done. I suggest you visit http://groups.yahoo.com/group/pauls-news/ and join. It is “Hidden” and can be accessed by members only. It is populated by people who have succeded at and presently are selfrepresenting.
hi, wellington. we will try it, thankyou
Union of Fathers are in Welington.
Phone them on 0508 2255 323 (0508 Call Dad)
Hi there great to hear im not the only one with basically the same issues. I would like to know how much damage has been created by our flawed system eg. Child support family courts I havnt seen my two children in 2 years as it is to difficult because of issues that you have encountered,i think your doing the right thing with your main arguement (go for it) Good luck with your battle you”ll need it.
HE WINS SOMETIMES
We have cases of a man winning, on paper. Usually is’t a humoristic judge who gives him custody, knowing very well that’s up to her to give kids. And nobody can force her. Millions of men have joint custody without even knowing where their kids are. Some men get even sole custody. One man “winner” in USA went to court 70 times to ask for his kids.
…….Generally, we have only 2 scenarios where men can really win:
Scenario #1: You are a powerful man who helps our feminist state abuse other men. Example: The judge estimates you ruined lives of 100 men and bastardized 100 kids. Police chief gets custody 100%. A cop – maybe, if he can prove consistent shafting of many men. How many? Depends on the personal opinion of judge.
Scenario #2: You are an upper class celebrity and your litigation would publicize feminist crimes. Their judges will not deprive a member of the royal family of his kids. Feminists need upper class as silent collaborators.
Or kick out the President and give the White House to his wife, based on her allegations of domestic violence. As they screw millions of middle and lower class men and bastardize millions of their kids.
………Note: Of course, many men have custody because she agrees, and these are the cases that feminists quote as counter stats. For example, one mom wanted to go to college, and she secretly accepted money from father as a compensaton for giving him the child for a few years.
Join equality groups in your vicinity! Fight, to bring feminsit criminals and their hired guns to justice!
hi, well we are in neither of the two catergories, but thankyou for your advice.
Hi Mother Love,
Yes, I am a father and I won custody.
I had always been the primary caregiver of my children from birth.
My ex had tried to kill my children multiple times during our seventeen year relationship.
My ex had plotted to murder me.
My ex had drugged me using God knows what.
My ex had tried to poison me by lacing my food with Jayes Fluid.
My ex alienated my children from me.
My ex beat my son up multiple times for wanting to live with me.
My ex prevented my children from having visits with me despite a Court Order.
My ex perjured herself with every single affidavit submitted to the FC through her crooked legal aid solicitor which prompted me to ask my solicitor to complain to the Legal Aide Authority about her solicitor’s conduct.
My ex promoted my (minor)child to participate in drug use.
My children were poorly fed, unkempt and missed much of their schooling during our FC case.
My ex was Ordered to undergo Drug & Alcohol counseling, Anger Management counseling and Psychiatric counseling. She completed NONE of it.
NONE OF THAT MATTERED AT ALL TO THE FC JUDGE
The FC Judge covered his cowardly arse after my ex threatened to kill herself in front of my children and he awarded custody to me. He dropped his nuts when he realised that my children’s blood might end up on his hands.
That was after almost three years and me spending $10.5k and me holding most of the information back from the FC in case it prompted my ex to attempt to kill my children once more.
So, how did I win? Either God was on my side or my children and I were just lucky I guess!
Fathers aren’t supposed to win in the Family Court. Only lawyers and mothers win there. I don’t know of any other father who has won custody in the FC.
My honest advice would be to turn your back on the FC process, keep your money and live your life. I know it sounds harsh. I’m just being honest with you. In my experienced opinion the FC is crooked!
Regardless, I do wish you the best of luck.
hi, well she (to my knowledge) has not done any of that, we have been in and out of fc since 2005 and at last count owe 8k in legal costs. my husband and i have very nearly given up the fight, but we took one last breathe and fought why ?? because we love these kids unconditionally and to go another fornight, year etc without them is uncomprehensible. through negotiation and fear of loosing this time around we gave up our fight for girl 13 she is now not reqd to visit and has not made any contact with us at all, we cannot sit by and allow the same to happen with boy 11, when we are capable of doing something about it.
thankyou for your thoughts and advice.
Sole custody is bad for kids in most situations. Kids do best with shared care and having both parents in their lives. Thankfully our legislation recognises this even if application of theory is difficult.
hi, i hear you and would prefer this option perhaps i could juggle things around to see if that is possible.
thankyou
Your story sounds similar to my partners and mine.
First of all follow Alastair’s advise and look at Paul’s-news, they can provide for info.
In regards to full day to day (custody), is the mother doing anything damaging to the child?
The reason I ask this is because we have an 11 year old who has been physically and psychologically abused for many years, and we are still battling, and he has told L4C.
I know this may sound ignorant, and I see you are represented by a lawyer, but has there been any mediated contact?
The mother sounds as though she is bitter over the break up and unfortunately sounds very much like the many women about, who as you have said, use their children as tools o get what they want.
An update for Menz. The mother signed the 11 year old over to CYF, she just gave him away, the Judge was not in the knowledge of this but L4C was.
He is presently going through assessments, we’re keeping our fingers crossed that he talks without fear of the mother.
I did similarly to the mother.
I agreed to a back-room deal, offered to me by CYFS, that meant I would sign my children over to CYFS. They in turn would ensure that my children remained in my full-time care. That meant I could get on with parenting my children without the hassle of the other parent constantly challenging me for custody in the FC. The mother would have needed to constantly challenge CYFS in the FC instead of me.
Their (CYFS) back-room-scheme worked for me.
CYFS offered this deal to me when I informed them that I would refuse to ever go back to the FC regardless of the stakes.
My children denied any wrongdoing by their mother. They felt a need to protect themselves from her reactions. It is years later and they speak about her abuses freely but at the time of the FC case their lips remained sealed.
Your post made me wonder if there is a back-room CYFS scheme in play here.
hi, i must admit that she is not all bad (present time) by that i mean no physical abuse, kids are fed and cared for, she has in the past dragged them around the country school to school etc…..she is very bitter over the seperation she will say anything and do anything to keep contact from happening she has nothing at all positive to say about my husband and i, basically she dumps her issues on them, uses the kids to voice it and blames them when we challenge her. it breaks my heart to see the kids so miserable.
thankyou for your advice
Hi everybody
I wanted to comment about a few things, my ex and I split just recently and things are as you can imagine really raw and painful. He had an affair for the last two years and I left taking our five children with me. I moved back to the home we bought together (which is in desperate need of renovations)n0 furniture (he refuses to send it back)and total emotional chaos in my kids and my own life. He moved on really quickly, cemented his new life with the other woman, carried on his professional career like nothing major had happened and cut all communication with me.
I’ll admit that I have blocked one weekend visit – i had been in a bad space and did some psycho things (screaming phonecalls, psycho emails, suicide threats and involving the kids in that act). But I came out of it and realised they needed to be safe and arranged for them to go with him till I got the help i needed. Except, when we spoke he told me he was going to KEEP them for two years but would be prepared to review things after a year. Well, I hid the kids and refused to hand them over and have been forced into applying for a parenting order. He maintains minimal contact with me.
I started surfing this site to get an insight into issues regarding the approach fathers might take with regards to custody – obviously trying to strengthen my case by knowing as much as I could about the ‘man’ position. When we were together – his kids were paramount to him, we have only been seperated for just under three months and he went from ringing daily three or four times, having them for eight days over the holidays to ringing them once or twice a week, and never on weekends (that’s his new woman time). He has cancelled a subsequent weekend with the kids – his choice. He seems to be the opposite of what I have read through this site.
I have continued to get help (mental health help) to stop being a typical hurt reactive and destructive ex-partner (Lord knows I have the power) who uses the kids at every chance she gets and have tried to negotiate reasonable and workable parenting situations (I offered 50/50 custody though he lives in the south island, i live in the north, and I don’t make him pay child support) with the father but its going nowhere fast – it assumes a certain level of communication. Keeping it out of the courts was what I was aiming for. I have a team of mental health specialists, I am reaching out (that is pushed alot for women in these situations)I have a team of “feminazis” (notice the quotation marks) from Womens Refuge furnishing my house and a great lawyer. What I am missing is the father who wants to fight to see his kids – I can’t make him do it.
I guess I just wanted to say that yes i can charm all the people i need to get my way, I have many more resources than most men are able to access, I have the Family Court (supposedly) in my corner and if I wanted – I could unleash the dragon and just cut his access for any number of fanciful whims that hit me at the time. But i wont. Not all mothers are the nut cases depicted through this website – and not all fathers are gallantly looking to protect their precious relationship with their children. (and yes I do work, and I’m paying for the lawyers bills – who needs christmas).
Good on you for being so reasonable for the sake of the kids. If only more parents would stop pretending the other parent is bad for the children. Lawyers and other family leeches rely on such rubbish.
If any parent has valid reasons to deny their children access to their other parent, it’s me. But I won’t. They’re smart enough to make up their own minds without my influence. I support whatever they want.
Children grow up to be adults with independent minds and their levels of respect for each parent are determined by their history.
I wish more mothers had your insight.
duin my best,
I do not believe any-one here is anti female per se.
we only protest about how institutions like FC are hijacked by the likes of women’s refuge and using women as tools. Believe me if men were in that posistion, i.e they have the favour of the family court believe me they will use the system in the same way. Check Saudi Arabia were women are second rate citizens. Oh yes. They have a justice system over there too. They have judges and lawyers etc.. But Justice is no where to be seen. Just like here in NZ.
Behind every murder of a woman in NZ there is the Family Court behind. Sorry I meant Women’s Refuge.
Women’ Refuge prey on vulnerable , fearful and week women. One carrots do not work they threaten removal of the children.
I pay child support, my contact progressed from unsupervised to supervised and I do no believe my wife is malicious but she does what she is asked to do. As she is following the protection order religiously, it means she will never contact me. I want to help her to stand against the wolves of Women’ Refuge but I can’t.
I now know the depravity of Women’s Refuge and the Family Court.
The Family Court is a total waist of time and energy.
If we boycott them, refuse in participating in their abuse of our children, if we stop hiring lawyers, if we spread the word about their deparavity if we unite as men and women and make them irrelevant then we will stop these thugs producing murders and strife for children. They are Anti-Child
I agree that nearly all fathers here are not extreme anti-female, I have complete sympathy with women who have had their kids taken by CYFS. They have the same problems as fathers like us
The growing power of the state is the source of the terror that most of us have been through.
Money feeds the beast of state power and “the best interests of the child” is the battle hymn of the republic
Martin Swash said: The growing power of the state is the source of the terror.
A very general statement, not useful for understanding whom to fight.
We have to specify what state, always, in our words and in our minds. We are facing the FEMINIST state.
Only when we understand that, we’ll stop being confused and we’ll get angry and want to fight.
It’s not bad wives or bad judges or bad child protection agencies. It’s our violent feminist dictatorship which gave women licences to plunder and jail men, and kill their babies. IZ
I think to some degree you are correct, I sought a lawyer at the advice of a Women’s Refuge supervisor, I was in a complete panic and totally overcome by the experiences she shared about other women in my situation. I was not in a good space to think clearly or rationally and relied totally on this woman’s advice. I had to – on top of everything else, thinking was just beyond me. Its a hard one because I am stronger now and listen to her advice but make decisions that count for the kids by myself but ultimately my ex did what she claimed he would and if she hadn’t of warned me in a general non-specific way my kids might not be here right now. I never expected him to pull a “you’ll never see them again” so going to the lawyer was far more timely than I realised.
I understand that women are not being persecuted through this site and the stories shared here are borne of extreme frustration with the system and its lack of empathy for fathers fighting for equal rights in family matters, I hope I encourage wider debate about issues and yes I believe the balance of power rests with the wrong agencies. You’re right, we need to work together as men and women to shift the balance and move towards a more inclusive, system.
I’d love to hear his version of events.
He must have had a sense that something was terribly amiss to have left and taken the five kids.
Oh i have such sympathy for your plight. I am in the situation where i have 2 children in a 50/50 arrangement but who suffer the mind games and manipulation from their mother much as you experience. The children suffer mental abuse for sure at the hands of their mother but there really is little that can be done until the children choose where they would rather be. I amd my new fiancee hespecially, have been lambasted as a evil father only concerned with avoidance of paying CS. Do people not think that seperation from your children is bad enough so why should we not battle to see them as much as we can??
I’m not a saint though and have been dragged into tit for tat games at times but seeing the bigger picture as the kids happiness i try my level best to provide a stable environment for them to live but ihave come to learn both in life and on here that bitterness runs deep with ex partners.
Though i digress my point here is that i looked into sole custody for this same reason, psycological abuse for which i have evidence. The lawyers/barristers/councillors all said the same. Whatever her mental state, proved or not she has a right to see her children. This factor ways hard on my mind but what do you do? Go to court where you know you yourself are going to put the kids through hell or sit back with the knowledge that yes they are not in the environment you would wish but their minds are growing fast and they seek that stability and comfort when they come home to you. This is what we have done and i have noted a chage in the children and their much more relaxed and happy when the stress is lifted and they are welcomed, if only for 50%. Don’t get me wrong they have a good life with their mother but they also have guilt trips, opinions of their step mother enforced on then, told what they can and can’t do when with me, listen to their mother literally screaming down the phone at their father…i could go on for page upon page…
Its a tough call and i wish you well “mother love”
thankyou for your comment, i cannot understand sometimes why people would be so bitter, at some stage in your life there must be a point where you have to let go in order to move on. we do not hold out much hope of winning here and therefore 50/50 sounds like an option. perhaps i am living in a fantasy world where eveything should be peaceful and harmonious. lol
It is well recognised that until you forgive, you cannot move on. This unforgiveness not only screws you up mentally it does it physically also. A large proportion of people (Female and male) who are perpetually sick with mysterious illnesses have unforgiveness in their life. There is a cure, this is not an appropriate forum. Contact me off list if you wish!
I must point out here too, apart from my crap spelling, that i pay CS for 60% of the time, recieve the kids for 50 so am infact paying 110% for their upkeep…fair?? I think not but hey, i battled for the 50/50 so whose complaining !?!?!?
I know one guy who pays $1450 a month in Child support, she coulkd be liable for $65 a month in offsetting if he bothered to claim off her. They both have the kids 50:50, he meets all scholing costs and most of the clothing.
Fair, you be the judge; it is just the way current legislation is.
However this dad loves his kids, does what is right by them and doesn’t complain.
Does not stop you joining lobbying efforts for change of Child Support Act which are proposed.
lol
Hi been in a similiar situation with step parenting and wanting full custody of children. In the end the Court ask the ‘children’ who they want to live with and so ends the story… in our case they chose the mother even though she didn’t want them only wanted the child support that came with them!
The vengeance of children can be subtle.
hi, yes so much of the decision and outcome is placed on the kids point of view- the mother had that base covered! our lawyer was not confident of a positive outcome for us- and that was only for contact to remain in place, luckily the judge saw through it and allowed contact to remain.
thanks for your comment.
In order to conceal the multitude and magnitude of their crimes against humanity, the femnazi’s repression of men becomes evermore bizarre, heinous and desperate.
And: It is now appointed into the (#3) United Nations where such effect drills into poverty, unless it is drive to relieve humanity of the male function is curbed from within its primary source of power (NZ).
Quite so.
The Family Court is not always as biased as you might think – my father has 5 kids by 3 different mothers and has full custody (or had – I’m 21 now, but my younger siblings are still in his care) of 4 of those kids. The other he did not go to court over.
And I do mean full custody – visits with my mother were supervised initially, for at least a year.
Oh, the Femily Court is definitely biased. I also won full custody of my children. The time,effort and expense required to accomplish that considering I was always their primary care-giver and that she was practically certifiable proved that. My journey to keep my children safe was saturated with Femily Court bias.
Their mother ended up with supervised visits for the first year (one hour per month).
I know of one other father who has won full custody of his children despite vehement opposition from the mother besides me now. Two wins don’t constitute balance nor disprove a bias. Maybe your father was ‘the other one’ that my solicitor spoke to me about.
I also know a father who has full custody (maybe we know the same person..lol). While all these stories are great, it doesn’t distract from the facts that they were the lucky ones.
During relationship services counselling I was told by the counsellor that the family court errs on the side of the woman. I’ve been told by lawyers that thsi is true and I’ve seen it with my own eyes. L4C is a classic example with my one only wanting to meet the children while my ex has them in her care. I’ve had psychologists say things that my kids have supposed to have said that I know are a lie. Mind you the same person wrote things about what I had said which weren’t true so I have zero tolerance for psychologists. The thought of a medieval witch hunt springs to mind.
By the way; does anyone know how my kids can fire their lawyer without the court using the old ‘they are being influenced by others’ excuse ? Do they need to get another lawyer to represent them and take action in another court ?
Make that 3, so did I!
I have just been reading about a French philisopher, Robert Briffault, who emigrated to NZ and studied at Dunedin University, his laws about women were as follows :-
The female, not the male, determines all the conditions of the animal family. Where the female can derive no benefit from association with the male, no such association takes place.
To put it in our terms, once the state can offer her MORE income than her husband, then she will think about leaving you. It is all these Social Security benefits from the state that single women receive that are one of the root problems of WHY we are being treated like we are. In England, single mothers can work 16 hours and receive huge amounts of “tax credits” which are equal to a married couple working 70-80 hours (paying tax). In most other western countries single mothers receive DPB, house, legal aid, etc etc etc. At the time of writing, Briffault’s law was contraversial because the man was still considered head of the family.
As a corollary to this law , has been added the realisation of divorced men that “Past benefit provided by the male does not provide for continued or future association”. Unlike men, women will not even think about the past love or money you have given her or your kids. This was of the things that so amazed me, women just think of your potential in the future, and if the state can offer more she will be off, and not think of anything you have done or given her in the past