MENZ Issues: news and discussion about New Zealand men, fathers, family law, divorce, courts, protests, gender politics, and male health.

Off topic, but thanx.

Filed under: General — Julie @ 1:03 pm Tue 20th June 2006

I have gained so much information and insight from males on this site and I want to tell you as many other people may do or forget to do, “Thank-you.”

From having the opportunity to sit with the North Shore mens group, I can see you really help not just a father and child but a person to find a way to have a chance to be what is important, being thier own life.

I could tell each one individually how special you are but it is what you do together that makes such a difference. You guys don’t do what you do for money, for you do things in your own personal time which you have a right to be selfish with.

What was so impressional to me was the fact that you do not lay blame, for you ask others what their part was and challenge thier fathering role. Not only that, but you give reality to men that may want to deny their women are serious and willing to use the Domestic Violence as a weapon.

Oh my God, you have taught me that I have brought upon myself the reactions I received from my ex-husband. I never saw my actions as encouraging violence until now. I used to put things down to outside influence like alcohol and drugs thinking that you and I were from different worlds but I now see that having a male come home to a house where his woman says, “You can’t come in, because I don’t want you here” is so outrageous. How would I feel working hard and being told in an instance that I am not allowed to enter my home, that I should sleep in my car and somehow in an instant start a life all over again. And then on top of that a huge chunk of my money is taken away from me. You are better than the best for continuing on against all the odds. You put up with us women and I can’t believe that you even want to know us.

I know I am a woman that you guys would normally see as the enemy but I have changed my thinking and I intend to change other women’s thinking.

What was so outrageous last night is that I was under the impression that I had cancelled last night and a friend who has never been into religion said to me, “Maybe God has something in plan for you.” A higher power is neccessary in addiction problems but not God. And then a knock on the door. If that sounds out of it then you know how I feel. But I received more than I hoped for.

So I want to thank you Paul C, Jim Bagnell, Jim Bailey, Dave L, Kerry, Murray, John P, Bevan, Stephen, Intrepid, Starr, Leon, Paul M, Mark, James and the all of you that care for mens issues because without you 300,000 children are without their fathers today and my boys won’t have even the slightest chance.



  1. Hi Julie
    we have at tines been “hard ” on you since you had in fact a tunnel vision approach to things. If yesterday has made an impact for the better of all on you then i am glad for you.

    what is your next move is what you now have to think about grasshopper.

    Comment by starr — Tue 20th June 2006 @ 1:14 pm

  2. Hi Starr,

    You sucked me in by your challenges. Being hard on me is a challenge and being told as I woman I am weak is a challenge.

    Comment by julie — Tue 20th June 2006 @ 1:59 pm

  3. Your welcom Sis.

    Comment by Stephen — Tue 20th June 2006 @ 2:05 pm

  4. Stephen,

    If I am going to put all the cards on the table which I should if I am going to help.

    I have been the anti-men woman. When I wrote I am the last person you want on this site and the males that told me -stay away from them, leave then alone. I wasn’t joking.

    Hey, I am not the person you want around for sypathy and rarely empathy. I am not a lesbian because I don’t see myself with women that way but only hard men can put up with me.

    I have respect for you, big time for not being easy on me.

    Do you know what is so funny? I am now telling my friends who are the bigger players than me – we are going to clash.

    Hey, they are OK about it. In fact they say I am brave and are looking forward to what I can do. I have earn’t respect through my actions not my words.

    The biggest problem I have is to allow you males to challenge these women because I am a very protective person.

    Comment by julie — Tue 20th June 2006 @ 2:32 pm

  5. Ah Julie then you have missed the sky by looking at my finger..
    the point i was trying to get across was
    1. “staying within ethical and moral grounds and giving everyone a fair chance” not undermining the other just because you have an advantage given to you by the state. Play hard but play fair. give only what you can recieve or as in the bible do unto others what you would want others to do unto you.

    2. “to view what nature intended all along” and be in harmony with it.

    Comment by starr — Tue 20th June 2006 @ 2:40 pm

  6. Hi Starr,
    Are you sticking your finger at me?
    This is something I could easily ignore and run away from. Not that you should care but what are you doing for this purpose. For that is the question I will always ask.

    Here’s a lesson or a challenge back.

    I come from a family that is Aussie and one that has worked really hard to get where we are. ( I was a big part of this, as I am an Auusie)

    DON’T TELL ME, SHOW ME. Actions speak louder than words. That’s how I was raised. And by my grandfather that was brought up in war times. He is and was always the head of our family and with the unbelievable respect and influence from my grandmother , aunts and uncle. What are you doing for men?

    I don’t mind some intellectual input, but from my upbringing, I find the workers are the leaders.,

    Please explain what you mean in layman’s terms.

    Comment by julie — Tue 20th June 2006 @ 3:07 pm

  7. Hi Julie
    the comment about the finger is a metaphor indicating when i pointed to the sky you only looked at my finger and missed all natures glory… in laymans terms you missed the point.

    2. treating everyone on equal terms is what i have always said in this forum. In laymans terms – don’t be unfair to a person just because you can. be ethical and honest in your approach to everyone no matter what the circumstance is, no matter what the consequence. End of it all you will be the one setting an example for the younger generation to follow. If you are unethical then the younger ones will follow thinking its al right to behave that way. if you are ethical in your approach. . you will then be an appreciated role model to learn from. The ethical approach is getting scorned at nowadays (probably due to mordernism- which i still cannot understand what it is as it’s perpetrators cannot give a logical definition- they just like to use the term mordern without knowing what it is) hence the result you see now– marriage breakdowns, kids on the streets fatherless/ kids missing a parent in their growing years etc.

    Comment by starr — Tue 20th June 2006 @ 3:23 pm

  8. Hi Starr,

    How does ethics come into relationships?

    Comment by julie — Tue 20th June 2006 @ 4:13 pm

  9. Very good question.
    ethics plays a very major and important role in all relationships. It builds you for what you are.It defines you. It is what you grow up with. In simpler terms what you would call your principles of life.

    Say simplest example- in a marriage i hear a lot commitment about Honesty. A bride expects her husband to be honest with her and vice versa. But does this happen? you and i both know it does not. why? because one party is in there to gain from the relationship without giving as well, hence the lies come into play. Now when the guilty party is reminded of the commitment made to honesty often you see the guilty party back away.

    to give a more specific example in todays times – false allegations. A lot is being made these days. True ethics would dictate you admit what honestly happened not make up stories or distort events. To the extent of whether it puts you in a good light or bad standing. Do you see this happening? NO. Instead what happens is….. well you know.

    Oh yeah i have heard the principle of various perspectives of truth. my comment- this is the most bullshit principle ever to have come into being and is being adopted by people who need to hide behind something to prove themselves innocent when they are not.

    Lets explore this principle a bit. If my truth is false from your perspective then your truth is false from a third party. What is the real truth?… my answer and as quoted by the Highlander movies ” there can only be one”. One truth and only one truth. The sooner this si adopted the better the future will be for our generations. This type of truth will only be achieved by a very ethical conduct. which means play a hard game but play fair. No fouls commited, non taken. Only then there wiull be a chance for our future generations to take heed and learn from the actions we set today.

    I could go on and on… however i will not treat you as a kid. You are an adult- responsible for your action and should know what these are or what i am saying to you. Only you can lead by example- good or bad is your choice – leaving something for our future generations to earn from. We have a lot to teach our future generations.. will you take up this mantle with me?

    Historical example- George Washington.

    Comment by starr — Tue 20th June 2006 @ 5:11 pm

  10. basically in my long winded way what i am saying is: do the right thing by everyone and all concerned, and when you do ensure your actions does not disadvantage anyone unfairly.

    Comment by starr — Tue 20th June 2006 @ 8:43 pm

  11. Hi starr,
    By the way my next step is to take my girlfriends that are most open to the next mens meeting at Nth Shore. Dave L. keep your back seat available.

    Ethics in relationships. Hmmm. I hav no comment.

    Comment by julie — Tue 20th June 2006 @ 9:16 pm

  12. Dear Julie,

    Thankyou for your kind words, It was a pleasure to have you honour us with your presence at the Mens Centre last night.
    If there is anything that you or the boys need help with (pulling teeth at CYFS etc…), you only need to ask.

    Kindest Regards

    Comment by Paul Catton — Tue 20th June 2006 @ 11:13 pm

  13. Thank you Paul C,

    Rang CYFS today, they have put file as priority. I have organised professional help with dealing with it. I think my son is beyond you or I on this.

    Comment by julie — Wed 21st June 2006 @ 2:11 am

  14. Starr,

    Ethics does come into play in all our actions and our words.

    I was thinking about ethics when people break up. The ethics seem to fly out the door.

    I think you discription of ‘grasshopper’ was good. Because i am finding it difficult to be on both sides at the moment yet it is neccessary and ethical. I will get no-where being bias.

    Comment by julie — Wed 21st June 2006 @ 8:30 am

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