MENZ Issues: news and discussion about New Zealand men, fathers, family law, divorce, courts, protests, gender politics, and male health.

Fatherless Children

Filed under: Child Support — Tigerseye @ 10:33 am Fri 25th July 2008

When the government sees fit to surgically remove the father from the family culture do they realize they are in fact turning a nuclear family into a nuclear weapon? A study done in Massey University in 1996 found the following horrific facts:

Fatherless Kids are:

5 times more likely to commit suicide

32 times more likely to run away

20 times more likely to have behavioral disorders

14 times more likely to commit rape

9 times more likely to drop out of high school

10 more likely to abuse chemical substances

9 times more likely to end up in a state-operated institution

20 times more likely to end up in prison

There is much more data out there to support this conclusion which is now more than just a theory. These are just the main bullet points. Not only do we suffer as Fathers with little to no access to our sons and daughters, which in itself is a heart breaker but the kids face even greater difficulties.

Remember, legislation encourages Mothers to do it alone… but look what happens when they do. This does not mean men are better then women or fathers are better then mothers, it means they are more powerful and effective when working together. Something that seems to be overlooked when the FCworks “in the best interest of the children.”


  1. A recent look at a group of prisoners revealed that all bar one did not know who their fathers were.

    Don’t forget that Men ripped from their families are more likely to suicide. A bit drastic but atleast it gets you out of child tax 🙂

    Comment by Alastair — Fri 25th July 2008 @ 11:33 am

  2. Hi guys, my wife and i have both been in prison and majority of both the men and woman are not just fatherless but parentless, they grew up going from foster home to foster home, running away and are now in prison, the sad thing is the same thing is happening with their children, vicious circle, i was in the army back home in Iran when my Dad died and i would do anything to have him back, my parents are my everything

    Comment by Hadi Akbari — Fri 25th July 2008 @ 11:52 am

  3. Does everybody remember this…

    I hope Hell-en’s minions are reading this, to you I say: You lead the country so it’s your country, these children are your children. You are killing your children!

    Comment by Tigerseye — Fri 25th July 2008 @ 12:24 pm

  4. Hi Tigerseye, dont ever refer to my children as her children, she is scum, and i think if she did have children they would definitly commit suicide, yes she is killing our children, this country will never belong to her

    Comment by Hadi Akbari — Fri 25th July 2008 @ 1:14 pm

  5. I agree with you Hadi, but I was making a point. Miss Clark seems to run this country as if she owned it rather than worknig for it’s people.

    Comment by Tigerseye — Fri 25th July 2008 @ 1:20 pm

  6. I have fought the NZGovt for the right to Father my Son as an Equal Parent since mid way threw the pregnancy that created him – Winning Equal Parenting during 1997 soon after I got rid of my then lawyer – Fought CS etc but then the real power of NZGovt struck once I became dependant on WINZ during 2000 because of continuing Heart and reflux hassles – WINZ have NEVER helped me week about Equal Parent my Son – It does not take much brain power to work out what that has done to me financially let alone what reduced Fathering I have been able to offer my Son..

    BUT – mother has been fully funded on the DPB for 12 years, yet she does half the job and pays as few bills as possible. And to boot is so fit she can walk from Beach Haven to Highbury and back daily yet does not work.

    My now 13 years in Fathering my Son in these current circumstances has got me thinking its MENS fault not the Girls who have simply got it ALL their way.

    Where are the MEN standing up to Father their own Kids and to support other DADS as they do their bit fighting for all Children to have the right to their own Father?

    Ration Shed – Jim

    Comment by Jim Bailey — Fri 25th July 2008 @ 1:22 pm

  7. Its alright Tigerseye, i am not angry and you made an excellent point, i just dont like the thought my son as one of her children

    Comment by Hadi Akbari — Fri 25th July 2008 @ 1:29 pm

  8. After sparing a big thought for every fatherless child on earth…………
    Have a big drink for me tonight you guys.
    I just had a huge win in the Family Caught and got several years of Child Support assessments reversed.I am the man.For the first time in 12 years of battling IRD I heard one of them say they made a mistake.
    When I got there today I was handed a bankruptcy notice by the IRD lawyer.They have been trying to serve it on me since last November.He then had to take it back after the judge made his decision.Told him to wipe his fat slimy as with it.LOL.
    After 12 years of study and frustration I may just be the foremost legal expert on Shared Care issues in these fair isles.
    I am in a bloody good mood and willing to represent you if you need help.
    If you need help with your battle and want to learn how to apply s12 of the act then message me at
    [email protected]
    My charges are reasonable and I am good.
    Will never take on a case if I do not think I can win and will return money if result is no good.
    Will also be flexible and maybe just prepare submissions for you and you can read them out in court yourself if you have a limited budget.Not precious about that.
    I got a lot of the latest legal authorities from the IRD lawyer as they threw all guns at me.Now they have to go and assess for my ex’s income for 4 years and also get money from my other ex as my living allowance was of course radically lowered.
    Thanks to Allan Harvey and Murray Bacon and Jim Bagnall and especially Paul Catton for much assistance and moral support.I love you guys.
    Good luck with the Protection Order Protest tomorrow.

    Comment by whanga — Fri 25th July 2008 @ 2:01 pm

  9. A big congratulations from me!!

    Comment by Tigerseye — Fri 25th July 2008 @ 2:29 pm

  10. A very big congratulations from me TOOO!!

    Comment by Jim Bailey — Fri 25th July 2008 @ 2:32 pm

  11. Excellent Excellent work Whanga, You are a champion well done, I love it!!

    Comment by Morph — Fri 25th July 2008 @ 3:05 pm

  12. It’s not many that can win against the IRD.

    Hadi – I also go into prison, under I suspect the same scheme. We ran a program recently entitled “Challenging Lifestyles” It was from being a facilitator that my comments come. Saddest of all some of the men id not know their mothers either being raised by a succession of Aunties and foster Homes

    Comment by Alastair — Fri 25th July 2008 @ 3:19 pm

  13. Awesome, Whanga is da man, i am so happy for you and remember you have always got the support of all these men who know what you are going through

    Comment by Hadi Akbari — Fri 25th July 2008 @ 3:58 pm

  14. Hi Alastair, I am back and forth to court on allegations cypfs social workers are making about me, abusive behaviour and threatening language, i went to ACRP for a weekend on hunger strike, the unit manager said he wants me out of his prison and if they dont let me out he would contact the high commisioner, this government know what they are doing to me is wrong and i will fight until the end

    Comment by Hadi Akbari — Fri 25th July 2008 @ 4:07 pm

  15. I beleive it has been the plan of many NZParliaments to destroy the Family – Given half a chance Courts, Police, Bureaucrats and other blindly obedient beneficiarys of Govt funding destroy our Families daily.

    While Men and those that love them mearly mutter on the internet, fight them in court, rage at bureacrats, we feed those determined to destroy family with information as to how to do it better.

    Sorry to put a damper on the Great Wins in Court and Child Support etc. that some of us have had but think again – For all of those of us that finally win how many have in fact commited suicide on the way or simply given up thru lack of support and encouragement

    I am not suggesting that anybody on MENZ or any other internet group gives up but quit frankly we are not enough to make the difference

    What will the dance in Hamilton really gain? Once again I am not suggesting its not neccessary?

    We have lost momentum and quit frankly what has been acheived anyway?

    Is it time to turn to the God of the bible?

    Comment by Jim Bailey — Fri 25th July 2008 @ 4:26 pm

  16. The question is, what can we do about it? As part of the documentary I’m asking (read – challanging) the minister of the CSA via email to answer these questions. I understand the MP is Judith Collins – is this correct or is it one of the multitude of othe MP’s?

    Comment by Tigerseye — Fri 25th July 2008 @ 4:28 pm

  17. I believe that it is the God of the bible we turn to each time we enter the court room. That which we, the judge and the ex swear upon for the truth.

    I Agree with Jim – I don’t hear anything in the news about protests in this regard. But man, put the road tax up and trucks from far and wide bring the country to a stand still!

    Comment by Tigerseye — Fri 25th July 2008 @ 4:34 pm

  18. Jim,
    we can all pray that things will get better (and we should) and /or we can prey on the IRD and the system. I may be just a bug biting the system on the ankle but if I bite them hard enough and long enough and all my bug mates bite the same ankle in the same place soon the ankle won’t like walking with that foot. Them the system has to morph to survive. We must be positive and make some goals.

    Comment by Morph — Fri 25th July 2008 @ 4:53 pm

  19. “Child Support” is slavery to government, simple as that

    Comment by Perseus — Sat 26th July 2008 @ 12:11 am

  20. Subject: NZ-Fatherless Kids – Yours comments on the BLOG ASAP please as this is going to all Political parties Monday 28 July pm

    Go to the Blog and comment ASAP Pretty Please

    COME to the Ration Shed Egroup and share your doom, your HOPE, your gloom you’re JOY
    Ration Shed SERVICES, FOOD and HOPE for the desperate and others who support us by generous donation.
    There is HOPE come see.

    Blessings and regards
    Jim Bailey supporting a fathers’ coalition
    and growing the Ration Shed. See link below.
    6 Lancaster Rd
    Beach Haven
    North Shore City, 0626
    Telephones – +64-9-482-2960 -/- 027-429-0055
    Fax — +64-9-482-2961
    Skype — HandsOnEqualParent —
    Emale [email protected]

    Comment by Jim Bailey — Sat 26th July 2008 @ 9:23 pm

  21. The info (stats) in the original link help me immensely as I am deeply into a Custody Battle at this moment, not because I want to, but my son has requested more time with me. He is 11, and I have already have Shared Care.

    So far it has cost me only $1400, but we havent even entered into the mediation stage yet, let alone Court if we get that far. I am gutted to learn that I may have to pay for the Court Appointed Lawyer who now acts for my sons best interests.

    I am quite daunted by the legal bills, but nonetheless I cannot stop simply my son is being (verbally) abused at this stage by my ex wifes partner, but we fear worse is yet to come.

    Also, we tend to blame the staff at the IRD…is it really their fault though? I mean they are subject to rules and we should not berate these individuals. I feel we should be attacking the Politicians, not the IRD. I view the IRD as simply the strong arm of the GOVT in enforcing an outdated and probably corrupt Policy.

    The Aussie Govt has changed the rules…eventually we will follow those rules.

    Judith Collins….all she does is to put men down over oustanding Child Support. She doesnt recognise there are heaps of Dads out there who really want to spend more time with our kids but the Lawyers bills are prohibitive. And Hell, I am classified as a high income earner.

    Since when did Dad have to pay for a Court Appointed Lawyer when one’s own son requested more time with his Dad? I am paying heaps for my own Lawyer. My ex gets Legal Aid even though she works and lives with a guy who earns more than me.

    The same guy has abused my son on many occasions and apparently does not want him.

    Mummy has collected in excess of $23,000 in Child Support over almost 4 years after seperation. Doesnt sound a lot, but I paid most of his bills and looked after him well during this period.

    The comment is, …we are doing everything we can to induce change. It will come eventually and in the meantime the lost kids will continue to commit suicide and indulge in crime at an alarming rate. It isnt safe to walk the streets today. It will get worse.

    Comment by Morris — Sun 27th July 2008 @ 12:23 am

  22. Morris,

    Many of us have had to bit the Evil $ bullet – You are right your Son is worth it — The $ should be going on Fathering him NOT fighting to Father him – I personally and some others have found we have done a lot better once we have fumbled and learnt to represent ourselves – That of course will not change the legal fees other than the fees relating to your own lawyer – However it puts you far square in charge of your own case and changes the relationships you have with all those involved in your case – The court and councils must deal direct with you as the litigant and thus you can see more clearly whats going on and can demand (Politely – professionally) and thus command more respect for your opinion – Don’t get bogged done in litigation – Remain the DAD you are and present and lead with the DAD side of you – A few litigant blunders will not hurt with polite recovery

    I personally am a Christian and depend totally on the promises in the Bible for guidance especially when in court – My success in gaining Equal Parenting very early more than proves God keeps his promises — Open all proceeding with prayer — I politely ask to speak first as a litigant especially when I have initiated the proceedings and ask to open with prayer based on Micah 6:8 — Have a look it’s simple.

    I don’t agree that one should not take the many bureaucrats and Ministers to task as we come across them – Many have a heart and can be affected by polite rebuttal and challenge of their integrity – Granted the hard and fast deliberately blind ones are a challenge — Having just been turned down for 100th time by the one and only Ruth Dyson in my attempts to gain Equal payment of ALL government funds allocated to Parent my Son as I do half the job as a week about Equal Parent and have done so since 1997.

    Check that the X is actually getting what you pay in so called Child Support – MOST don’t and we find the years of arguing over CS with the X has been wrong – Yet another ploy of Govt to put you in damage control

    Stay cool my friend you have many years to go if your boy is only 11 and you will need much DAD energy to Father him let alone fight the system


    Ration Shed – Jim

    Comment by Jim Bailey — Sun 27th July 2008 @ 3:05 am

  23. So how much do you get a week in Child Support payments Morris?
    I hope you realise your ex’s partner’s income can be taken into account.

    Comment by whanga — Mon 28th July 2008 @ 4:09 pm

  24. Well done and congratulations Whanga.

    Tigerseye – can you provide the references you have for your statistics?

    Comment by Hans Laven — Tue 29th July 2008 @ 11:54 am

  25. Yes I can, anyone can… google is your friend 🙂 Knowing who compiled the statistics, however, isn’t as important as the statistics themselves and what should be done about it, wouldn’t you agree?

    Comment by Tigerseye — Tue 29th July 2008 @ 12:07 pm

  26. We can all give a great big vote of thanks for the Stuart Birks of this world. Stuart is a long time supporter of the mens movement.

    If you are disseminating facts Tigers eye it certainly lends credibility when these references are quoted without having to be requested. Look at the refuge industry who spout meaningless figures. If there is one thing we need it is credibility, and respect for those who request it.

    Comment by Alastair — Tue 29th July 2008 @ 2:38 pm

  27. I agree, however I hope our focus is in the right place.

    I mean no disrespect to anyone.

    Comment by Tigerseye — Tue 29th July 2008 @ 2:43 pm

  28. While talking of deseminating (Good word) facts have a look at Paul Callisters work go – Onward – Jim

    Comment by Jim Bailey — Tue 29th July 2008 @ 2:52 pm

  29. These stats have been around for years and years but no-one in power does anything about it. Makes me sick. At least we all know about it, and are trying to get others to know but it’s not enough really is it?

    Comment by Scott — Fri 29th August 2008 @ 2:13 pm

  30. My wife (2nd marriage) and I have been subjected to 8 protection order applications over the past 10 years, by my children’s mother (to date no protection order applications have ever been granted), Family Court Orders and Parenting Orders have been breached by the children’s mother. Parent Alienation from my children and the constant battle for access, contact etc has been our life for the past 10 years. In and out of the Family Court that all cost many thousands per year (as the respondent only, never the applicant). Alligations made in many forums including ‘Fame and Shame’ nz website about both my wife and self giving full details of name and my employment, also within this very website. The mother of the children was damming and played the victim of a newly broken marriage (married twice and engaged since) and claimed I did not want to be involved in my children’s lives she also went as far as asking for advice on this matter. In true form she then turned on this websites developer and phoned his home to verbally abuse his child, also submitting vulgar messages to other subscribers to menz issues. She then came back some months later and used a ficticous name and continued her barrage of lies and deceit while I had to remain quiet and not respond.
    I now believe it is appropriate timing to advise that my children left (walked with there feet) December of last year to a family members home for safety from their mother. They have not been back since and refuse to have any contact with her. This caused involvement by police,cyf,family court, independent psychologist report and now a local psychologist for intensive therapy for the children and to re-establish the relationship btw myself and the children (my wife and daughter to be included shortly).
    Due to constant PA the children have believed what has been constantly fed to them over the years and hence that is the reason they did not come directly to me. I am pleased they are now safe. I am also pleased that the truth is out – it was their mother whom has abused them emotionally, psychologically and physically while pointing the finger at me and my wife. There have been many professionals who have sat back and colluded with the mother, also having important information that they did not report to appropriate authorities that left the children in dangerous situations. These ‘gate keepers’ are now trying to unravel the damage that they too helped to create. I was perceived as a violent man, I believe this was a stereotype due to my culture and size.
    My wife was granted a ‘Restraining Order’ under the Harrassment Act last week that now finally protects her. We have had to deal with threats made to kill us and harm the children in 2005, she (kids mother) stated if she did’nt do it herself, she would pay someone to do the job as she has the money and the contacts. This was minimised by cyf and family court.
    I am now seeing the children and its wonderful for all of us. The kids are wanting more contact and I am hoping to one day be the day to day carer of the children and we can be a family again.
    So please hang in there for your children’s sake, one can only control a child for so long before they grow up and will want to know the truth.

    Comment by Molly — Sun 12th October 2008 @ 10:21 pm

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