New Zealand Family Court has officially ruined my Family
Having been though the Family Court for the past 9 years, of which I was given just enough hope that I may actually get “Justice” and though the family court be able to establish a relationship with my son, that the Ex would not allow.
In Year 2 of the Family court process I had my 2nd child, and Year 3, my 3rd. in various times over that 9 years me and my new partner had come very close to separating ourselves due to the pressure the court process was putting on our relationship. In Year 8 it finally got to much (plus other issues) and I ended up separated yet again, and now trying to get as much time with 3 children between two mothers. And given the fight I had in regards to my 1st child, the mother of my younger children had always said that she would not be like that. But as it turned out not only did she turn out like that, she was learning the system, meanwhile lowering my defenses, and knowing I never wanted to go though the process again she played me. We Separated a year ago last week, and had a private agreement which has changed as our personal lives have changed, over the last year. It was all going reasonably well until Christmas came up.
In 4 separate occasions between June and November she confirmed that I would get my two youngest children for the afternoon of Christmas Day, so during those 4 months organised for my oldest child to travel to me for Christmas, as it would be the first time in 5 years that all my Children had spent Christmas day together.
On the 22nd of November the mother of the oldest 2 dropped a bomb shell “Sorry Ive been thinking about Christmas day, and trying to plan it out, and there is no way we are going to be able to make it home for 3pm, so Ill have the kids for Christmas Day, and you can pick them up on Boxing Day.
Nothing I said to her would get though to her the importance of having the 3 Kids on Christmas Day, and she wouldn’t even give me a decent explanation as to why she couldn’t get to where we agreed to do change over.
So I sought legal Advice, and was duley advised that I should put a without notice application for a parenting order, knowing that it would not be accepted, but given its in regards to Christmas contact, would be put as urgent, with notice to respond reduced to 3-5 days, and a 15 min issues/directions confrence to be set down.
So I went though the process, and followed the instructions on the application form, and provided all information it asked for, even if I did not feel it was immediately relevant, so out came the history of her involvement with CYFS, how she goes a bit crazy when pregnant, and that she was pregnant with her 3rd child…. I filed the paperwork on the 30th of November.
Well the judgement was as expected, 3 days to file a notice of response, issues conference, directions conference to be set down, and lawyer for child to be appointed, with 14 days to provide a report, and help resolve the Christmas contact dispute. I was ecstatic, I might still have a chance to have my children all together for Christmas Day finally.
Then 3 days later, I get a text from the ex about Christmas Presents etc… So I tell her anything to do with Christmas is now a matter for the Court, talk to your lawyer, the kids lawyer, or the Court for anything Christmas Related.
Then she informed me she had not received anything from the Court. So I ring the Court, and find out, it has not only not been served, but it also may not be served for another 7 days as it is not “URGENT”, it may take up to 14 days for the Lawyer for child to be appointed, and that no issues conference, or directions conference would be set down until after the Case Management review on the 6th of March 2016!!!!!
So now I have played all my cards, all in regards to 17 hours contact that the ex has “taken” away the information provided in the Affidavit is damning towards her, so I can see what was reasonably civil parenting relationship turning hostile once she does get served, and knowing that nothing is going to happen till MARCH, probably end up taking more time away from me just because she can.
“Family Justice” YEA RIGHT!!!!
Should be called the Department of Family Killers
So short of causing a scene and attempting to pick up the kids on Christmas day, is there anything else I can attempt to get this happening?
Im gooing through the same thing for the last 5 years and Im not the other person is and no proff execept in the childs mind all locked up.
Can be unlocked in this case
Comment by Murray Whittington — Sat 5th December 2015 @ 2:57 pm
I would be irritated to have my Christmas day plans with the children changed, but Boxing day would do. In the circumstances you describe I’d very reluctant to involve the family court. In my experience their involvement only make things much worse. I’d withdraw the application for a parenting order.
Comment by nickcoop — Sat 5th December 2015 @ 3:01 pm
i knew it would make things worse, but to just let her get away with changing things at the last moment, would also lead to things getting worse, anytime you sit back and let someone walk over you, it’s just telling them that you’ll roll over for anything. And given the effort in getting my older son up, I couldn’t do nothing. And given she actually said to me if you don’t like it, take it to court, I didn’t have many other options. Since posting this post, I’ve written to her parents not sure what the response will be, it’ll either be, tough, let her do what she wants, or, they will be on the ph to their daughter saying wtf, are you up to (her step dad been through this sort of shit for his son.) if that doesn’t work, I’ll be left to turn up on Xmas day, and make a scene if I have to….
Comment by Nzleagle — Sat 5th December 2015 @ 4:05 pm
Having had 12 years experience of Family Court 1978-1990 I tend to agree with nickcoop on this one. FC & CYFS & Other Agencies pretend to support parents and follow the “child’s needs are paramount” philosophy but in reality 99% of those who work in/for those organizations don’t really give a shit as nzlegal has discovered. Negotiated access seldom works. For the last 5 years before both daughters turned 16 I used the Guardianship Act 1968 (now Care of Children Act 2004) to file an ex-parte application for enforcement of access order so that each time I was supposed to have kids in terms of Court Order the Police picked them up while I waited at the Station. Ex-wife soon got tired of the neighbors seeing her kids being taken away by cops so became less obtuse with access arrangements. Ironically both daughters left home as soon as they turned 16 and when they had kids denied their mother visiting rights. Couple of years ago the MOTHER who thumbed her nose at Family Court Orders throughout the 1980’s took her own daughters to Court to try and gain access to her grandchildren. Application denied. Sometimes the Family Court actually gets things right and in this case a wise (female) Judge saw the Applicant for what she was.
Comment by JONO — Sat 5th December 2015 @ 4:19 pm
Obviously you have the wrong lawyer. A friend of mine had troubles just a week before Christmas and had an urgent hearing that went in his favour.
Comment by prouddad — Sat 5th December 2015 @ 5:27 pm
interesting opening comment about “Justice” and “Family Court”. These two statements do not go together in N.Z.
I as many N.Z. Fathers have gone through many years of abuse by the N.Z. family court system, and a ex psycho whose one purpose in life appears to be to make it near impossible for you the father to have any relationship with your child. One thing I found works (because the courts do not work), if you have a written agreement of the visitation day (i.e. Christmas day in this case) you can go to the Police and list your child as a missing person, this is because you have an agreement that the child should be in your custody and the child is not, in fact you have no idea where your child is……
so the child is missing and the police are obliged to look for any missing child. Obviously the Police do not want to do this, so they will contact the mother and put as much pressure as possible to have the mother return the child to the person who should have custody at that time. This is not fool proof, but can help, also useful tool with any future planned court evidence of the mother evading contact between the child and the father.
As stated before however my experience is the courts are extremely biased to the mother and will in fact allow obvious breaches of a family court order without any penalty to the mother but will admonish the father for bringing a breach to the attention of the courts.
all I can say is good luck, get deeper pockets for a good lawyer
Comment by binga — Sat 5th December 2015 @ 8:51 pm
I get the feeling you put in the application yourself, rather than use a lawyer, which I fully support.
In such cases it’s not hard to come up against some smart bitch in the office who effectively decides the case by dicking you around.
When they’ve done something obviously wrong, you toddle off to the High Court and start talking to them about an urgent hearing. This usually prompts the High Court registrar to ring the silly bitch in the home of the lazy and incompetent and ask what the hell they’re playing at.
You may have to accept Boxing Day as a fait accompli, but that needs to be dealt with by way of complaint to the Minister of Courts, and possibly even legal action against the registrar for interfering with your case.
Keep your eye on the ball.
Comment by Downunder — Sun 6th December 2015 @ 6:46 am
The ombudsman exists to investigate incompetence and injustice by government departments and officials. For the FC to schedule a response next March for an application concerning events this December is both incompetent and unjust. If the FC thinks it can get away with that, then the police may as well schedule a car to visit your house two weeks after you called them to inform that an intruder is in your house while you and your children are home.
However, a complaint to the ombudsman by any father or male should be made before Boshier becomes the next chief ombudsman!
Comment by Man X Norton — Sun 6th December 2015 @ 8:50 am
I don’t think it’s a case for the Ombudsman. It is a case of interference in process by a judicial officer. I think that needs to be looked at by the Minister of Courts.
But you would need to view the file first and make sure there isn’t a judges minute ordering the registrar to behave that way.
Comment by Downunder — Sun 6th December 2015 @ 9:35 am
Having been separated and having managed to keep a great relationship going with my children I offer the following points, which you might find useful:
1. The court process has nothing to do with justice, but is simply about power
2.
Comment by Joseph — Sun 6th December 2015 @ 2:22 pm
Having been separated and having managed to keep a great relationship going with my children I offer the following points, which you might find useful:
1. The court process has nothing to do with justice, but is simply about power
2.
Comment by Joseph — Sun 6th December 2015 @ 2:22 pm
2. In the western world, which is based on feminist thought, power belongs to women, and the ownership of children belongs to mothers. With this ownership comes all the rights to Xmas, birthdays, etc etc. Most women love harassing their exes, and will sabotage any attempts to compromise their ownership rights.
3. The best thing you can do is simply opt out of all these events, and simply build an alternative life revolving around your access rights, which are strong. The system will back you to enforce these, but very little else.
3. Forget about shared custody; the women who administer the system are implacably opposed to it, and sabotage it every opportunity.
4. Understand the Court simply administers this power differential. Forget any notion of justice or “what is good for the child”. You are just a second class citizen, and you just have to work around the system. Fighting it is as futile as fighting for justice as a black teenager in Chicago. Forget it.
4. Side stepping the matriarchal court system, and using my access rights to the max, I build a great life with my children. When I had them we made life a celebration, and my children loved and cherished our shared life. I flagged Xmas, birthdays, etc etc, and told my children we would celebrate these things in our own time.
5.I utterly ignored my Ex (who is not mentally well), never went to Court, and only used my lawyer to insist in my access rights.
6. I told my children that they had two families, two parents, and that they should love and respect their two parents, but never try to blend this two families together, because it would never work. As they got older they did try to do this, but now understand the wisdom of this strategy.
This has worked pretty well, and my children and I have a strong sense of family. Looking back, I am really happy to have all these years of being a father to my children on my own terms, and have reconciled myself that, as a man and a father, I am simply part of a society which systematically tries to oppress me. However, by simply creating my own life, and sidestepping the matriarchal power structures, as much as possible, and by understanding that many women see men as second class, relatively powerless citizens, and who will exploit them if they are given the chance, has enabled me to live a life of great autonomy and dignity, and has enabled me to have great relationships based on autonomy, strength,and realism. Paradoxically, love flows out autonomy.
So my advice is to be strong, understand the system and your place in it , and create an alternative universe for you and your children.
Joseph
Comment by Joseph — Sun 6th December 2015 @ 2:56 pm
Sadly, I have no advice which is not already covered by the above comments which I agree with.
But my wife was never a serious adversary and is indeed nowadays a close ally. It was the Government employees and the NGO’s who caused most crap.
They all had the chance of helping, but bypassed that in their rush to shaft me. And as already said, this never was about the children’s best interests, the state’s behaviour shows that.
But I will say, there are good ladies out there who have principles, self discipline, and won’t behave this way against us men. So maybe we need to stop and review the way we choose females to be close to us.
I’m not sure if this can be a helpful seed, or just a weed; but here is how I got past Xmas bother. Realise that even being a custodial male, I was still at a disadvantage in Xmas negotiations. So I booked myself and the kids into a restaurant for Xmas dinner. I then advised the ex that she and her mum could buy seats at the table, Having a paid up arrangement seemed to help. But you may smile how it played out. Come Xmas day, I had a severe case of Gastro and could not possibly drive 40kms each way, let alone dine. The ex advised of this, agreed to my second accuser’s mum going in my stead. So my ex and her mum, met my new partner who brought the kids along, and who had the authority over them. By accounts my ex was pretty subdued, but it all went well, because both those ladies help each other out these days and they work equally for our girls. Who would have thought?
Comment by Equality — Sun 6th December 2015 @ 5:43 pm
I can’t agree with this.
If you read the judgement of the Lords from England, essentially that says; a child remains in the care of its mother provided she obeys the laws of the State. If there is any ownership it is to the State. I see it more as control over the life of the individual resting with the State rather than the Mother, the Father, or the family.
Comment by Downunder — Mon 7th December 2015 @ 5:37 am
You may think that is a little pedantic, but I suggest you look at the legal definitions of the words ownership, possession, and control, and you’ll find there is a much better case to suggest ownership of the Father by the State, than there is for the child.
Comment by Downunder — Mon 7th December 2015 @ 6:44 am
I am going through something like this except it is my father and my ex partner doing it to me no contact, supervised visits even though theres no evidence of me doing anything wrong to lose my 2 year old son 1 week after his 2nd birthday! however mine has been going on for 7 months and I plan to get my rights back as a mother and a parent of a child I have looked after, gave birth to and taught.
Comment by Nicole — Tue 1st March 2016 @ 1:43 pm
There’s many of us here who know how you feel Nicole, usually its the dad that has such troubles.
But more and more commonly mums are ejected from family’s by family caught 2.
I hope it all works out for you and your children toghther!
Do you have a lawyer. Legal aid?
Comment by voices back from the bush — Tue 1st March 2016 @ 6:09 pm
Nicole (#16) If your father is joining your ex-partner in supporting supervised visits then there are significant aspects to this story that we haven’t been told.
It’s true that the Family Court, given its poor standards of evidence and proof, gets things wrong far too often for mothers, fathers and children. However, that Court’s feminist bias causes most of its injustice.
Comment by Ministry of Men's Affairs — Tue 1st March 2016 @ 7:16 pm