MENZ Issues: news and discussion about New Zealand men, fathers, family law, divorce, courts, protests, gender politics, and male health.

Got The T-shirt

Filed under: General — Downunder @ 10:40 am Sun 5th June 2022

[A screenshot from a msm clip of the Tauranga by-election. Unrelated to the post]

What caught my attention was the T-Shirt in the picture and that it got mainstream attention.

Tauranga has long been an independent back burner on men’s issues and it’s been the hub of probably more new (relevant) organisations than any other place in the country.

For those of us who go back 20 odd years to the early days of the Clark Administration bumper stickers and T-shirts were highly political.

Even JP wasn’t going to wear a bumper sticker on his car and the one that was donated to the cause outside the North Shore Men’s Centre had a very short life on his bumper bar.

T-shirts were expensive to print and I know as I got a few quotes and even contributed to the production cost of some.

The real problem was getting guys to wear them outside of any orgnised event. The political pressure or the effect of political pressure meant that advertising fathers issues was like an admission of failure.

It’s great to see someone with a T-shirt even if it suggests that particular organisation is in the recovery stage after failure.

Fathers and men are still a highly political subject and we’ve got used to that rather than men actually being fathers “in their own right”.

I say that, meaning any man who isn’t in a stable relationship with a supportive partner is in a highly contestable position.

I couldn’t make out much of the question being asked at the time but it was around the issue of fathers, families and gangs … gangs being a current political issue in the Bay of Plenty.

We’re still a sensitive subject and I haven’t got around to tracking down the recent Listener article about the “War On Men”.

I haven’t seen any comments on that Listener article here, JP and can we republish it on this platform?

Is there still a war on men?
Still a political controversy around fathers?
Have we reached irrelevance and are we considering a comeback?

Anyone else got a new T-Shirt?


  1. Hi Downunder. As far as I know, Listener articles are not available on the web.

    Because of copyright, the “War on Men” can NOT be republished here unless written permission is obtained from the editor.

    I learned my lesson the hard way many years ago when I scanned a photo of Men’s Centre North Shore from a local paper and included it in a printed edition of MENZ Issues. The newspaper promptly sent me an invoice, which I reluctantly paid on the advice of lawyer Rod Hooker.

    Any article can be summarized, and quoted from, but not published in full. If you do find it on another website somewhere, I see no problem with linking to it.

    Comment by JohnPotter — Sun 5th June 2022 @ 7:33 pm

  2. There is a Spinoff article about the Listener article.

    Comment by Downunder — Sun 5th June 2022 @ 8:36 pm

  3. That link is an excellent find Downunder. You could almost call it mainstream media. The abstract…

    “You men won’t see it coming and it’ll ruin your life. So many lives have already been ruined. Jobs lost, fortunes seized, livelihoods threatened. It’s happened to so many men, and it could happen to you”

    Seems the Listener magazine is May to June 2022. Sending the link has made me aware of it, and now I’m going to buy a copy. Who sells them?

    Comment by Lukenz — Mon 6th June 2022 @ 7:05 am

  4. I usually frame this as, “The casualties of Peace”.

    Comment by Downunder — Mon 6th June 2022 @ 8:07 am

  5. I had a copy of the listener, on teenage fathers.
    Unfortunately, at some point it got thrown out.
    But it works the same, as the spin-off article.
    It starts off, mentioning things about men.
    But ends with all the bad, done to women.
    Without seeing it, I can guess the listeners story line.

    A vague piece of writing, saying things are happening.
    But void of any specific, laid out allegations.
    No detail crime by crime, of paternity fraud.
    No accounting, of costs to the falsely accused.
    No statistics, on biased policing and charges.
    No summary of money spent on women, or men.
    And no mention, of the female sexual predator.

    Men can’t wear T shirts, telling the truth.

    “I would consent, if you were actually on the pill.”

    “I may be drunk, but I’m still legal for sex.”

    “I’m underage, but even IRD knows I’m legal.”

    “I only got married, because I thought it was mine.”

    “Sex and my house, have short term relationships.”

    “God decided, men cannot physically have children.
    The family court, decided the same.”

    Comment by DJ Ward — Mon 6th June 2022 @ 11:46 am

  6. We bought the Listener with the article about The War on Men. The article suggested (not intentionally…) the book was femicentric, more focused on justifying the feminist war than defending men, and failing to highlight many of the ways in which men are suffering and discriminated against.

    As for the Spinoff article linked here, it’s typical stuff from that unethical publisher. The article amounts to hate speech against men though we can bet Ardern’s communist censorship plans won’t result in men being protected in any way. The Spinoff is a left wing publisher that shows little concern for truth or accuracy in its production of propaganda promoting feminism, wokeness and other fashionable causes. Unfortunately, our other mainstream media including taxpayer funded Radio NZ treat the Spinoff propaganda machine as if it has something worthwhile to contribute.

    Comment by Ministry of Men's Affairs — Thu 9th June 2022 @ 10:28 am

  7. Oh, and the t-shirt depicted here appears to be another example of indirect, patronizing criticism of men. ‘Raising Fathers to Save Our Children’ implies that some special intervention is needed if men are to be raised in a way that will protect children. It’s not needed. Fathers are inherently protectors of their children. A very small proportion don’t do that well due to addictions or other factors, just as is the case for mothers.

    Truth is that fathers’ protection of their children is actively sabotaged by our laws and Courts through emasculating men and colluding with women in trashing father-child relationships. A better message on a t-shirt would be ‘Ending Feminism to Save our Children’.

    Comment by Ministry of Men's Affairs — Thu 9th June 2022 @ 10:55 am

  8. @6

    Thanks for that. I still haven’t had time to do that much.

    With the sudden development of alternative media sites across the country and there have been a few besides the “The Platform” there is an opportunity for this site to make a more significant contribution.

    It’s likely that these smaller organisations would be closer in thinking and link to this blog.

    A lack of contributing authors and content would be the significant issue for MENZ at the moment, though.

    Seeing names and faces in articles here is also a resource for these outlets plus a source of people who might be interviewed.

    Comment by Downunder — Thu 9th June 2022 @ 10:57 am

  9. Like race based discrimination the Men that are causing the real problems are the problem, laws need to be based on these statistics. I know I am pointing out the obvious but the rhetoric must be not to taint all men with the same brush.

    Comment by mama — Thu 9th June 2022 @ 11:59 am

  10. The ‘Shame Game’ Mama.

    Feminist’s insist all women must work together and look after each other.

    If one man do wrong, all men must take responsibility for that.

    The idea of personal responsibility just doesn’t survive in feminism and that’s the same argument we were having 25 years ago.

    Comment by Evan Myers — Thu 9th June 2022 @ 12:23 pm

  11. Thanks Evan, for filling me in, what an tiring and impossible ride you guys are on,, I just can not stand that it will continue on and on, especially in this so called enlightened era where everyone must have their due… I will gladly take part in your Hikoi…

    Comment by mama — Thu 9th June 2022 @ 12:44 pm

  12. “The newborn can’t ask, who’s my daddy.”

    “Perjury, is a privilege.
    The child is his, your honour.”

    “Even grandma knows, the sons kids may not be his.”

    “When you find out the condom in the rubbish bin, was a bad idea.”

    “When she removes the condom, and your 99% there.”

    “We met, when I woke to a person in my bed fondling my genitals.”

    “When she slapped me, you pretended it didn’t happen.”

    “I’m not worried, about child support.
    I already, pay the maximum.”

    “After losing the plot at me, she demanded sex.
    I was leaving her, but now with the baby and all.”

    “I never new, I was a dirty secret.
    Until I tested, my DNA history.”

    “A women asked me, how many kids you got.
    Geez, only women know that answer.”

    “After four fathers, all ending with DV behaviour.
    It’s still the mans fault, if there number five.”

    “I asked the cop, for a men’s refuge card.
    Even his phone, couldn’t help.”

    “After she hit me, I was going to ring the cops.
    But didn’t want to make, my absent dads mistakes.”

    “A cougar, is a predator.
    35 no kids, and not on the pill.”

    Comment by DJ Ward — Fri 10th June 2022 @ 7:35 pm

  13. If one subject was going to create argument between women, it’s weight.

    So some T Shirt, comments.

    “Nagged men smile, when they think of gaffer tape.”

    “Another impossible task, solved by Macgyver.”

    “Want to start a fight, with a woman.
    Say slim is sexy, while holding gaffer tape.”

    Anyway, if you go to the extreme.
    Her analogy of the tape, being a code for don’t eat.
    You will become very slim, over time.

    Something I must manage, as I’m slightly overweight.
    And I simply eat whatever I want to eat, likely also unhealthy.
    But to manage my weight, I do have to decide not to eat.
    I myself do what she says, by missing meals I figuratively tape my mouth.
    If I didn’t do that, I would not control my weight.

    How can a comment with truth to it, be disgusting.
    Being overweight, is always dictated by that choice.
    Putting something in your mouth, or not doing it.

    Can you then define medically for each person, there own perfect weight.
    The computer, even accounting for bone structure or muscles.
    People’s opinion of perfect, irrelevant to the science.

    So for me I like the honesty, of her comment.

    Comment by DJ Ward — Sat 11th June 2022 @ 8:02 pm

  14. “Good news, the doctor said I’m sterile.
    Bad news, he told me after having kids.”

    “Feminists want 50%, that’s actually funny”

    “I thought I had everything, until I met her.
    I didn’t think, that meant 50% of everything.”

    “If the patriarchy existed.
    Men would always get the kids.
    Women would ban Child Support immediately.”

    “Most workplace deaths are men.
    Danger pay, is not equal pay.”

    “Someone woke said, old ….. men.
    You know the middle bit, is racist.”

    “My mother, didn’t name my dad.
    No, I don’t know my whakapapa”

    “If suicide is the measure.
    Men’s privilege sucks.”

    “Ram raiders, steal a pittance.
    Wait to you meet, a family court lawyer.”

    “No is no, and yes is yes.
    But no can become yes, and yes can become no.
    Are you confused, MeToo.”

    Comment by DJ Ward — Sun 19th June 2022 @ 8:17 pm

  15. With a small edit, this could be legal.
    Otherwise ignoring humour, it’s technically wrong.

    Change “must have, to “could have”.
    Then all women, can apply.

    The argument about men, not needing traits is good.

    “That last bit is interesting. If you’re a man, that’s okay, you don’t need a particular chest measurement, a smile, or a “winning attitude” (often shorthand for, don’t think you can come here and complain about your working conditions.) You just …need to be a man?”

    But I doubt men are not judged, by the employer.
    Or that considering workplace deaths, men have issues.
    You may not expect a smile, for the night club security.
    In hiring them, chest measurements are observed.

    When we demand equality, do we stop reasonable acts.
    The job add for a nanny, may be written genderless.
    But the reader still knows, it’s for a female.
    Strangely I think it’s a bad attempt, at saying that.

    If success is free publicity, it’s a winner.

    Comment by DJ Ward — Sun 7th August 2022 @ 10:06 am

  16. It’s hard to think of my home town, having problems.

    Many questions, could be asked.
    What high school, did they go to.
    What area of town, do they live in.
    How many, are from fatherless homes.
    How many, have been in state care.
    At what age, did they get technology.
    Are the children, living in personal poverty.

    If they have no value in themselves, give them some.
    To be radical, as a solution is a sentence of work.
    Experiencing real life, when wages are minimum.
    Unfortunately child labour, is a modern wrong.
    Maybe retail would love, the after school helper.

    Anyway making fun, of Palmerston North.
    Which does have a history, of rioting.

    Palmerston North, has its own weather.
    Palmy, meaning windy or raining.

    Palmerston North, home of riots.
    First biker gang riot, Easter Saturday 1972.
    First child gang riot, winter of 2022.
    50 years, with little change.

    NZ, land of great coastlines.
    NZ, town planning.
    Palmerston North.

    Comment by DJ Ward — Sat 13th August 2022 @ 6:59 pm

  17. Tagging is an oddity, for gendered offending.
    And not only boys, but young men offend.

    The behaviour can’t end well, with accidents.
    One must ask, why males behave in this way.
    What’s going on with ego, to put there name.
    Why isn’t it a comment of protest, or poetry.

    Why aren’t the females, doing the same thing.
    If you need proof, there is clearly gender difference.

    Anyway, T Shirts.

    Old school social messaging.
    Without a like button.

    Students of literature.
    Need proof your bad at reading.
    (With samples of tagging)

    Everyday spelling tests.

    Chances of girlfriend.
    Sports star, high.
    Star student with a job, high.
    Tagger, (unreadable).

    Comment by DJ Ward — Sun 14th August 2022 @ 11:07 am

RSS feed for comments on this post. TrackBack URL

Leave a comment

Please note that comments which do not conform with the rules of this site are likely to be removed. They should be on-topic for the page they are on. Discussions about moderation are specifically forbidden. All spam will be deleted within a few hours and blacklisted on the stopforumspam database.

This site is cached. Comments will not appear immediately unless you are logged in. Please do not make multiple attempts.

Skip to toolbar