MENZ Issues: news and discussion about New Zealand men, fathers, family law, divorce, courts, protests, gender politics, and male health.

Contempt of Caught? Where did the honour go?

Filed under: General — MurrayBacon @ 11:35 pm Thu 4th September 2008

About 5 years ago, I requested a copy of the Family Court Judge’s Benchbook, under the Official Information Act. The kind young man in Justice Department that I spoke to said he couldn’t see any difficulty, but he would double check with the Principal Family Caught Judge, Judge Mahony. (I offered that as it is probably fairly large and I only wanted to look through it, I would be happy to return it after a couple of weeks.)

I heard nothing back, so after about 7 weeks, I wrote formally and then eventually received a reply stating that judges are not covered by the Official Information Act.

Certainly, while acting judicially they are not, but I wasn’t requesting anything containing personal information about any case.

Judge mahony essentially refused to honour the Official Information Act. Although I was surprised, I wasn’t that surprised. He just dropped one step lower, in my estimation. I didn’t follow this breach up, as I was fairly confident that I could access all of the information through libraries.

I was glancing through the Pennsylvania Courts website and what should jump out and hit me – but the Pennsylvania Sexual Violence Benchbook! A couple of minutes later, I was reading it.

The Canadian Government has a policy for making official information publicly accessible on the internet, where it is perceived that the information may be of a degree of public interest – they will do this proactively. Pennsylvania is obviously doing the same.

Benchbook on Crimes of Sexual Violence in Pennsylvania

When NZ judges hold the legislation in contempt, what sort of a caught system do we have?

Especially, when they try to hide behind mis-interpretation of black and white legislation, they just leave themselves looking like……………….

I have heard other people making similar complaints about judges treating other legislation with contempt. There is a need for citizens to take political action, so that deadwood judges can be reinvigorated (electric shock treatment?) or replaced with working units.

Judge Boshier is more proactive in publishing, even going so far as to publish judgements of cases gaining bad mention in the news. I support his attitudes towards complying with legislation and being dramatically more honest with the public. His heart is in the right place (values). He has been a much more worthy recipient of Government largess than judge mahony. I could see people using the word integrity in the same sentence as boshier. It is a pity that there is such a divide between Judge Boshier and the rest.

Do you see NZ as just falling further and further behind the world?
Best regards, MurrayBacon.

25 Responses to “Contempt of Caught? Where did the honour go?”

  1. Karen says:

    well you experience with Boshier is better than mine, I don’t have much faith any any of these family court judges,,,or the police who tolerate purjery,,,if some of the women that lie so blantantly in court got charged with it then there would be a lot less of it

  2. Jim Bailey says:


    Your observation of how the old Silver Fox and Boshier differ is a compliment to the young fox being cleverer than the old.

    Who has gained thru his cleaver spin doctored news releases?

    Boshier has made the FC look more open and friendly yet increased the devastation has he not?

    I would ask you and others to dig deeper into all Govt agencies as to their convenient all to often spin doctored use of proactive publishing

    The publishing designed to make the actions of Govt, be it CYF’s, CS, FC, WINZ look like they are doing the best possible for all of us while quietly screwing ALL who don’t fit their picture of how things SHOULD be.

    An obvious is the naming of so called Child Support

    Very little if any money paid to so called Child Support, supports the payers Children – It does support failed NZLaw and NZSocial policy.

    What about WINZ working for Families. Yet another lie – Show me any Families NEEDING support that get it thru the working for families package.

    My latest personal experience was when WINZ tried to hide their 8 years of ABUSE of me and my Son. WINZ have refused to honour our FC Ordered Equal Parenting orders now some 8 years. They have made a huge fuss of me thumping a desk to highlight the ABUSE and then refusing to release the security footage because it showed others at WINZ at the time?

    So what! – Govt spin doctoring to hide the truth is nothing new

    If more of us talked about it and shared our stories as Cyfswatch attempted NZ would be a better place for all

    Onward – JimDAD

  3. Jim Bailey says:


    To answer ‘Do you see NZ as just falling further and further behind the world?’

    As I see it NZ is leading the world behind

    We, tax payers fund UN reps who are blatant over the top feminists – We, tax payers fund many a CEO of Govt agencies including Boshier to lecture, thus give and gain technique to destroy Family overseas.

    Onwards – Jim

  4. MurrayBacon says:

    Dear Karen, my own personal experience of judge boshier was unsatisfactory.

    I have heard of other people’s experience in which Judge Boshier has come into a case and taken a totally different course to the previous judge. This was of great benefit to the child. However, judge boshier did not address the cost to one parent, of the milking litigation that the previous judge willingly went along with and through which both lawyers had profited, at the expense of the child.

    My own loss was small, compared to the good done in the other type of situation.

    None of these legal workers is going to show any initiative, for providing a good quality, cost effective service.

    If WE want this, then WE must do something about it!

    In this area, as in all other areas of commerce, the purchaser must check the quality and the final cost, before making their purchasing decisions. It ain’t like they show on TV drama programmes, so don’t be sucked in by the marketing for the legal workers.

    Cheers, MurrayBacon.

  5. Black Cat says:

    MacBoshier seem’s a mysterious fellow, i would not like to cross his path under a full moon…

  6. MurrayBacon says:

    Better him, than any of the rest!?
    Better in moonlight, than in the dark.
    As Deepthroat said to the Washington Post reporters, “Follow the money!”.
    Cheers, MurrayBacon.

  7. Black Cat says:

    If you wonder why all too many politicians appear to not be representing the best interests of their constituents and our country, perhaps the answer can be found in the simple fact that these politicians know where their bread is buttered!

    The additional problem we now face is the apathy of all too many New Zealander’s who don’t vote and don’t contact their elected representatives. This apathy makes the politicians believe that success depends on getting enough money to pay for their ever more expensive political campaigns.

    Simply stated, the major campaign contributors are apparently getting, “The best government money can buy!”

    We the people must stop sitting on the sidelines but must become involved in the political process. That is the only way to make our democracy truly represent our citizens.

    Democracy is not a spectator sport!

    Lead, follow or get out of the way!

  8. MurrayBacon says:

    Dear BC cb,
    I will be happy to get out of your way, if I am confident that you are doing something, rather than just talking?

    Dost thee have a bigger spud gun than I?
    Methinks thou dost protest with words too much and with actions insufficiently?
    Cheers, MurrayBacon.

  9. Black Cat says:

    “… many wearing rapiers are afraid of goosequills.”

  10. MurrayBacon says:

    Guilt for copy and paste, or the guilt for not doing anything?
    Apathy is in the water supply, so it is a hard fight with yourself, to rise above it.
    Responsibility for self is the quickest path to changing any situation, but for the dregs and tail end of our society, it is the last remedy that they think of trying. Moaning doesn’t really change the world, we are only fooling ourselves.

    Anyway, we are all our own worst enemies, so the hardest opponent is within our measely selves.

    I will double the stakes, do or DIE!
    Better still, roll up on Tuesday night, at Mount Eden Normal School Hall 7.30 pm and hassle a few aspiring politicians, or the piece of paper they have sent to represent them. So far, the politicians are winning 4 to 3 against the voters – from the last meeting, three weeks ago.
    The link above shows several links to the politicians speeches on YouTube, made three weeks ago, at Mt Eden School, on the subject of Supporting Together Families.

    Introduction and thanks to candidates and politicians

    Also my introduction is on YouTube, where I note that politicians and candidates contribution to our society isn’t well enough appreciated by voters. When voters are apathetic, then they deserve everything that they get from the Government.

    Someone complained to me that they pressed the YouTube button “watch in high quality” and expected that YouTube would cut out the waffle and dishonest comments, but it only meant “visually higher quality”.

    Cheers, MurrayBacon.

  11. Jim Bailey says:

    Black Cat,

    You are onto it

    Though I am not as sure/confident that voting well and taking responsibility for the gift democracy can be will alleviate our troubles with NZLaw and NZSocial Policy

    I am sure most MP’s enter parliament with open honest hearts

    I am also sure most MP’s enter Parliament very naïve

    By the time they learn some of the ways of Parliament they are either bent or beaten

    Thus we vote for the Bent or beaten

    Onward – Jim

  12. MurrayBacon says:

    Before we criticise politicians, we must remember that we are only a small number, out of all of the people asking for their consideration.

    The politicians most important knowledge is perspective.
    Without considering all of their supporters, they will be fired on a Saturday night. Their perspective comes from listening to a very wide cross-section of our society.

    If we show consideration of the viewpoints of others, perpective, then we are more likely to be listened to.

    Funny isn’t it, to be listened to, we must first do a lot of listening?
    (And show that we understood it!)

    If we ask for too much, we are likely to get too little.
    If we ask for too little, we are likely to get too little.
    Defeatism is giving up, only part way down the path.

    So a broad perspective seems to be a good place to start.

    I get the feeling that presently, a few men are treated a fraction as badly as 30 years ago, a woman might be treated, who had been left pregnant by some man who may have misled her. There are many examples of harsh treatment in our history. There are many examples of care and consideration. Without bumps, we could easily go to sleep.

    To some extent, men other than the impregnator, are still wearing that responsibility 30 years later. It is baggage, or unsatisfied damage and while not properly addressed, the harm is still with us. To some extent the harm is ongoing.

    So stop moaning and fuck up and crawl away and DIE in silence!
    Alternatively, why not try to address these issues constructively?

    If we don’t have a broad perspective, we have little chance of being heard.

    Society has always been very hard, cruel even, on some small minorities. I believe that it is better now, than in years gone by. MMP is a big part in this. However, obviously we still have some distance to go.
    Negotiating involves lots of listening…..

    Hope I heard you right?
    Cheers, MurrayBacon.

  13. Black Cat says:

    murray, murray, murray, don’t worry, worry, worry, so much….

  14. MurrayBacon says:

    I get to see my children every few weeks and usually when I want to. Sure, I haven’t been able to see as much of their upbringing, as I would have wished. I cared for both principally for 3 months and for one for 18 months, as well as Non-Custodial-Parent for twenty years.
    I am mainly involved, because of my concern for my children possibly going through the same or even worse treatment, as NZ drifts into a future including a familycaught which seems to be losing wisdom and common sense and gaining other people’s money.
    I have seen some life without hope and I have been given hope.
    Without hope, their isn’t much in life.
    Most people can make their own hope.
    I hope someone can give you hope?

    A truck told me:
    We teach our children about life and they teach us what life is about.

    Have your children told you this?
    Should I be concerned for black kittens?
    I hope you can enjoy taking the right amount of responsibility.
    Cheers, MurrayBacon.

  15. Black Cat says:

    you are a good man murray bacon, this much i know, i believe we both have telepathic powers, because during late morning i said to myself in my mind that ‘hope is a dangerous thing’ and you have replied in the early afternoon on this website with a reply, this time you are right, thank you for your telepathic response to my negative thoughts today. Over and out – Black Cat – nine lives later – there just may be hope lurking out there for some of us… here’s hoping…

  16. MurrayBacon says:

    I have lost hope, after meeting judge green (now trading as clarkson) and judge robinson, when asking for assistance to resolve 2 child kidnapping/abductions.

    I still remember the feeling in my stomach, walking into a caughtroom, with a very strong intuition that I was about to be patronised and laughed at by the “judge”. In those days, it hurt more because I was more scared of the damage that relationship-vandalls can do. Now I know that good relationships can survive a surprisingly big amount of vandalism and survive fairly well. I am not accepting it, but it isn’t so scary now.

    I keep a couple of 4 foot axes in my kitchen. To feel comfortable, I need a ready reliable escape route from NZ, at all times. It is a joke really, as a 4 foot axe is awkward to use, for escape. My confidence is improving and I now also have a 2 foot axe. I try to laugh at the sight of it, but they always remind of of where I have been.

    I eventually learned that some of the people in whom I had placed trust, were not trustworthy. So what, there have always been cheats, liars, thieves and confidence tricksters around. You just have to reassess your friends and your foes and get on with making the best of life.

    Judge the value for yourself, before you rely on trustworhiness.
    Some people say trust no-one, until they have proven themself.

    Life can be good – so why make it anything else?
    I may have had some of my children’s time stolen, but I learned the hard way, that the loss was much smaller than what I still had, thank Christ.

    So now I can laugh with contempt at the self-important relationship-vandals that I have had the pleasure to meet. When you protect yourself, by being sensibly cautious, then you can enjoy these clowns for what they are.

    Besides, trying to assist a few other people, gives me a better perspective, much safer too.
    I am hoping to have the last laugh? More to the point, working for it……
    Cheers, MurrayBacon.

  17. Black Cat says:

    and may your axe chop many a piece of wood or tree to keep you warm on a cold night… As Ghandi said:

    “Even if you are in a minority of one,
    the truth is still the truth”.

    (family court judge at work)

  18. Black Cat says:

    to be more specific, i liken this video clip to Family Court Judge Patrick Grace, thank you Sir for offering me 3 hours contact to my son under supervision, after 7 years and four family court judges to come to that decision, well done Mr Grace, you are a credit to this country. However, i did not accept your offer, so i dedicate this video to you; since you look so alike to this tyrant, how fitting…
    Happy Fathers Day to you too…

  19. martin swash says:

    We maybe few (not that few btw and growing more and angrier by the day) , but our injustice is very very serious, in the same way as in the 60s when single mothers’ used to have their babies taken away by the state “for the sake of the kids”. I am very surprised that more ex wives and law officials are not being victims of vigilantism really. Taking our children away is a terrible thing to do, the state does this for financial reasons to make us pay for the woman’s Social security (the slave masters used the same techniques on negro fathers in 17th century). They want to turn us into slaves of the government by “child support”.
    It is not the 1950s, women do not own children, GIVE US OUR KIDS BACK

  20. Karen says:

    my partner foolishly consented to a protection order to prove he was child foccussed and that he understood he would then get access to his son,,(ex claiming emotional abuse on her and the child) who is now 15 and is demanding to come and live with his father, no access for two years so back to court, also the order was to be dismissed after a year, two years later we applied to have it dismissed and the former wife has now filed a 56 page affidavitt declaring him (and me) emotional abbusers of this said child, Judge Clarkeson said she was not allowed to make any more allegation without a lawyer but she just carries on carrying on,(without a lawyer) ,where do we start to disprove this rubbish, is there any previous decisions where the mother has been stopped from doing this that we can use

  21. Colin of Nazareth says:


    Maimonides argued that executing a defendant on anything less than absolute certainty would lead to a slippery slope of decreasing burdens of proof, until we would be convicting merely “according to the judge’s caprice.”

    An oft-cited legal maxim from his pen is: “It is better and more satisfactory to acquit a thousand guilty persons than to put a single innocent one to death.”[12]

  22. M Swash says:

    All this injustice that we are facing can only be changed by a sea change by politicians, it is a question of human rights. Can i ask maybe a stupid question ? Has anyone ever challenged the human rights’ aspects of all this in court ?
    Legal awards of 1000s of $$ are made to victims of “stress” at work, and we have to go through this trauma, of having our kids stolen from us due to these despiccable laws , suffering near suicidal stress and we no rights whatsoever ?

  23. Jim Bailey says:

    All my attemps to bring a case to so called Human Rights have not got past the commissioner Ros Noonan

    They have been blocked by her political speak suggesting my applications were beyond her powers

    Sorry tried to dig up her replies on this here old computer but cant find them

    Ben Easton has gone a lot further than myself to no avail

    Human Rights is of course of Labour govt lead dept and of course Ros Noonan has a political apiontment

    The chances of challenging anything that will challenge Labour policies and I assume National Policies thru so called Human Rights will never work in NZ

    Try anyway maybe new blood is what is needed

    Onward — Jim
    Supporting, a fathers coalition and building the Ration Shed

  24. Karen says:

    I have often wondered how some of these cases would go in human rights, where children are forced to under go drug testing by a parent and are subjected to rounds of family court procedures, and parents that are subjected to on going complaints by one parent, is it worth a try, I do think so

  25. MurrayBacon says:

    Those who don’t know history, are doomed to repeat it.

    Tim Groser has followed the same approach as judge mahony did, many years ago with me. He could have guessed that I was a separated father, paying child support and carrying costs of children, so I couldn’t take the financial risk of a judicial review.

    Being practical, perhaps Professor Kelsey has a better chance of an honest hearing, than I would have had…..

    So, apparently judicial review can work successfully.

    Like prosecutions for perjury (Chris Cairns is taking his chances in UK at present), the question is does the law ever work when it is really needed?

    Where I have seen many opportunities for socially valuable perjury prosecutions, the occasional prosecutions just look like show cases, where the cases that really matter to society are never seen in a caughtroom? The socially useful perjury prosecutions would deter “profitable” legal process of no social value. Too costly to the legal workers, to contemplate.

    It is all so gamesy, like a judge pulling in a fishing line and letting it out again, until the member of the public is financially exhausted.

    Entertainment yes, justice no.

Leave a Reply

Please note that comments which do not conform with the rules of this site are likely to be removed. They should be on-topic for the page they are on. Discussions about moderation are specifically forbidden. All spam will be deleted within a few hours and blacklisted on the stopforumspam database.

This site is cached. Comments will not appear immediately unless you are logged in. Please do not make multiple attempts.

Skip to toolbar