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CYFS destroys fathers and children

Filed under: General,Sex Abuse / CYF — Julie @ 6:34 pm Fri 23rd July 2010

How far will a father go to protect his little girl?

Two months ago I wrote about a father who has been protesting outside Prime Minister John Key’s home, Social Minister Paula Bennett’s office and CYFS offices around the country.

He has been trying tirelessly to save his 3 year old daughter from her mother’s abuse and gang affiliation.

New Zealand like other western countries follows feminist ideology when it comes to heterosexual relationships and uses the presumption men=bad and women=good. If a man does something wrong it’s ‘men’s power’, ‘ the myth of men’s superiority’ and ‘Patriarchy’. When women do something wrong it’s ‘men made her do it’ because of ‘men’s power’, ‘the myth of men’s superiority’ and ‘Patriarchy’.

Men have received the blame from the very beginning of ‘girl power’ where girls were encouraged to compete with boys and cheered when they could do something better than a boy while boys were encouraged to build the girl’s self-esteem, go easy on them and protect them from hurting themselves. If the boys failed to do this, society came down on them like a ton of bricks. “Good girl, bad boy” was something this generation of children were raised with and in turn as adults, they have placed it into law and policy. The writing of our laws don’t look to be discriminative but the policies on how the laws are practised are.

This not only puts men at a disadvantage but children who have abusive mothers. Statistics show mothers to be the greatest abusers of children, then step fathers, then biological fathers. Regardless of why this is or what sort of abuse it is, the children that suffer aren’t capable of raising the alarm to their abuse. They rely on another adult to protect them. Knowing this, New Zealand has poured millions of tax paid dollars into advertising the need for adults to speak up for children and not ignore the problem. Politicians have vowed for society’s vote, to tackle the problem with a zero tolerance on child abuse.

Primary schools have social workers who look for child abuse, childcare centres and community groups are trained to know what to look for, nurses won’t let parents leave the maternity ward with their baby if there’s an inclination something isn’t right, police arrest parents under policy that won’t allow exceptions and judges prosecute. There’s so much put in place to protect children until it clashes with feminism.

CYFS feminist policies for fathers is evil. Not only is a child never to trust a father but a father cannot protect his child. In this case the mother has a ‘P’ addiction and spends her time using and dealing drugs with the gangs. Ordinarily CYFS would care and take the child from the mother but because of it’s policy against fathers and that the father in this case (as in quite a number) can take care of the child, the child’s welfare comes second to feminism.

The child is being physically abused and the father wants it stopped. He told CYFS their decision to place the child in the mother’s care was the worst decision they could make but CYFS didn’t care to listen. He proved her ‘P’ addiction and CYFS turned around and said the mother could smoke ‘P’ but only outside the house. The father took the child to the doctor to have her wounds cared for and CYFS put a protection and supervision order on the father so he could not see his daughter nor ask if she was OK. The police have arrested him while the mother is under their radar for drug dealing. The child has been present in drug busts of gang members homes. The mother has 3 children in her care and they have spoken out on video and CYFS refuses to acknowledge their cries for help. All this has been in the name of destroying a father.

Every single National politician has been contacted with the Prime Minister saying, get rid of this father and those that follow him because he is going to bring bad publicity on us. MP Paula Bennett has just ignored this father’s pleas to care for an abused child while she publicly tells society she cares deeply for children.

Yesterday the 22nd July 2010 CYFS finally uplifted the father’s little girl and 2 other children in this mothers care. As you can imagine, our father didn’t sleep well last night and yet he’s been having sleepless nights for the past 10 months.

Today being the 23rd of July, our father is at yet another CYFS meeting where they will try to negotiate everything but allowing him to raise his child in a loving family.

CYFS and the police are worried for the father’s safety as he has uncovered not just his child’s mother’s drug dealing but that of the gang association. It’s a huge drug ring that will protect many parent’s children. As well as this lots of CYFS social workers (I mean lots and lots more to come) have been either fired or left CYFS for drug use and other corrupt behaviour. You wouldn’t think one father could take on a whole system but it has happened. He has CYFS safe houses under surveillance where children are being abused and CYFS are begging for addresses.

Alongside our father are MRAs and others that care very much for the welfare of children and their parents who are being abused by the system.

Who’s to know what is yet to come and what else this father has hidden away. I guess there is no limit to how far a father will go for his little girl. May all little girls be so lucky and may society start seeing that men are important.


  1. to all this is the kind of thing that has been goin on around this country.
    cyfs have alot to explain about there so call job to protect children
    how can this goverment funded office has alot of abuse coming from these people around the lower southland as far as southland this is not a ideal place to have our kids in foster care or being looked after cyfs
    myself and my partner are goin thought this whole ordeal with i am also a father that is goin through the same similar kind of problem from these cyfs people
    i have join him on this site for help with cyfs
    keep up the great work
    hope to have help aswell

    Comment by kevin wilkinson — Fri 23rd July 2010 @ 7:39 pm

  2. i wouldn’t be too surprised if it turned out in the future that the CYFS were actually supporting child porn behind the scenes under the guise of “protecting the children”…..

    Comment by karan jiharr — Fri 23rd July 2010 @ 8:26 pm

  3. Who wrote this piece?

    Comment by Hans Laven — Fri 23rd July 2010 @ 10:36 pm

  4. If you are referring to the post, I did. All me, every word of it. If there is something you don’t agree with, you can say so.

    Comment by julie — Sat 24th July 2010 @ 9:54 am

  5. Julie,

    In neither this article nor the one you posted earlier, do you provide the father’s name or his whereabouts (city would be enough). If he is protesting publicly as you say, and in front of the homes of high-profile people, it’s hardly likely that he would object to being named – if anything, he would welcome all the publicity he could get.

    Names, places and dates matter – without them, we can’t tell truth from fiction. Other people wanting to further publicise his position don’t know how to approach him. Maybe there are lots of other people in similar positions who would like to talk to him. If any harm comes to him from dirty dealers, none of us would know. I’m sure there are other good reasons for providing more explicit detail. Whatever reasons there may be for suppressing them seem to be overridden by the man’s very actions.

    One of the very real and positive roles web-sites such as this can play is that of an alternative media, reporting on what the mainstream media won’t touch. You’re making a good start, but without verifiable facts, it’s not very effective.

    Or are you venturing into advocacy fiction to promote father’s rights and plights, as Connie Chastain (of the False Rape Society) has recently suggested, and it isn’t obvious enough to me?

    Comment by rc — Sat 24th July 2010 @ 11:24 am

  6. RC, sorry for not linking to the father’s work. You can find it here.

    Comment by julie — Sat 24th July 2010 @ 11:59 am

  7. Thanks for that link Julie.

    For other readers, the man’s based in Auckland and he frames his protests as being for men’s rights and justice. He has published an itinerary of protests that he’s conducting around the country here:

    He’s already attracted a face-book freind count of more than 1,000.

    Comment by rc — Sat 24th July 2010 @ 12:35 pm

  8. i verify that everything that has happen to daniel as i know him personly as to which he he doin his best to help myself and others with there fight against cyfs he is taking a break due to recent events
    i would like some help with myself and my parents fight we are having with gore cyfs the head social worker and her muppets are male haters i have been sworn at by the head supervisor of gore cyfs at told me i have no f***ken rights towards my step sons problems

    Comment by kevin wilkinson — Sat 24th July 2010 @ 1:02 pm

  9. I’m sorry this is happening to you Kevin. I’m sure you are hanging in there also but it must be very hard to be powerless and hated by a government department.

    Where are you in NZ? Maybe there is something we can do to help.

    Comment by julie — Sat 24th July 2010 @ 1:29 pm

  10. You are not the only one. We have one also in Gore! At this point no permission to post names but ……..

    Comment by Alastair — Sat 24th July 2010 @ 4:45 pm

  11. i live in mataura just 10min drive to gore in southland

    Comment by kevin wilkinson — Sun 25th July 2010 @ 1:18 am

  12. Kevin Wilkinson, do you deny that you physically abuse your step sons??

    Comment by dr — Sun 25th July 2010 @ 9:37 am

  13. Are you aware that making serious public allegations against someone who has publicly identified himself, under anonymity and without a shred of proof, is cause for a defamation case against you?

    Comment by rc — Sun 25th July 2010 @ 10:07 am

  14. when a child or someone acts out in a voilent way by law you are allowed to physiailly restrain them if they are goin to harm themselves or others that is wot happened here that i was told from the police and by cyfs
    and even then the children got taken

    Comment by kevin wilkinson — Sun 25th July 2010 @ 10:24 am

  15. No, sorry, it’s a good piece that seemed like a professional journalist’s work.

    Comment by Hans Laven — Sun 25th July 2010 @ 10:31 am

  16. Like a professional journalist… so it was an insult! lol just kidding.

    Comment by Scott B — Sun 25th July 2010 @ 10:33 am

  17. Hans,

    No, sorry, it’s a good piece that seemed like a professional journalist’s work.

    Thank-you! I’m chuffed you’ve noticed my improvement.

    Comment by julie — Sun 25th July 2010 @ 11:07 am

  18. Hi Kevin, I know about your case because I asked and want to encourage you to hang in there and don’t let awful people who come on this site to have a go at you, get to you. Try not to lower yourself to their standard.

    I’ve seen it before with other fathers. Every one of these fathers have come out the other end and their children just love them to bits.

    Sadly, one of the downfalls of being a man IMO is that you are expected to be a rock in stormy seas. You are in good company and you will win because it’s the children you care about.

    Comment by julie — Sun 25th July 2010 @ 11:52 am

  19. Can you please remove my last name from this post

    Comment by daniel — Sun 25th July 2010 @ 2:24 pm

  20. CYFs are meant to remove children when they are out of the proper control of their parents (for a considerable period of time, as all children are out of the control of their parents for quite a bit of time).

    Part of the problem, is that skillful judging of parents is practically impossible to many social workers, who had unhappy childhoods themselves – probably about 70% of them. These emotionally crippled social workers cannot perform their tasks faithfully or successfully, as they are blinded by projections of their own childhood unhappiness, in ways that they cannot see what is blinding them. Skillful recruitment would prevent hiring of such social workers, but alas, wages restraint by Government ends up ensuring that this problem is more prevalent in the social workforce, than in the general population.

    Our children are worth better protecting. This funding would have to go to people who successfully act to protect children (obviously not legal-workers of any guise!).

    Ifs CYFs were sincerely attempting to protect children from neglect and injury, then they would publish the statistics for children injured, neglected and killed, whilst in CYFs care. It is only by being open and honest about what is really going on, that they could ever hope to improve the quality of care that they provide to children put into their care, by the familycaught. Trying to manage children’s care and safety, while keeping the statistics secret, is like trying to protect your children, with your head buried in the sand.

    When we, as a country, compare the safety of children in CYFs care, to safety of children in parents care, can decisions about protecting children be made with any confidence that we ARE ACTUALLY improving the protection of children. We cannot have this confidence at present.

    Creating an image that children are being protected, by spinning false information and failing to release the actual statistics, dooms our children to experience the familycaught and social workers, as just an unfair odds lottery.

    I have never seen statistics for neglect, injury or death of children in CYFs care, published in their Annual Report each year. While these statistics are being kept as secret as possible, then they are clearly protecting the social workers paramount interests, OVER the children’s interests.

    It may seem challenging, that parents can have children removed for over-discipline and for under-discipline.

    However, this is the tightrope that parents MUST be able to walk. Social workers should be honest judges of parenting skills, but too many seem more lost in their own difficult upbringings.

    Sure, good parenting is a challenge. Smaller families make it far more difficult to pass on parenting skills to our children.

    Society’s expectations are increasing fairly fast, so that parenting that was generally acceptable 25 years ago, is now no longer acceptable. The difficulties that these raised expectations create, is not enough discussed in public. More discussion about these problems and their breadth, might encourage more parents to seek and accept help. It is worth it.

    Parenting under skill disadvantage is extremely hard work and rather unrewarding. By contrast, OK and better parenting is probably life’s greatest pleasure. We can see it on the faces of the monkeys at the zoo any day. It is unfortunate that most people are very reluctant to take up any form of parenting training, particularly those who seem to need it the most (or who would gain the most from it)! Yet when well done, maybe with some help along the way, it can change depressing hard work, much of the time, into great pleasure.

    It might seem unfair, that people with emotionally deprived childhoods, would find parenting skills the hardest to learn. Rather than fight it, the time would be better spent on working on learning parenting skills. Ongoing support is often required, rather than watching like vultures, ready to pounce and tear the flesh off families.

    I have looked into parental suicide. One of the best approaches for protecting our children from decamping through suicide, is by improving the parenting that they see, particularly in the first 3 years. Parent trust offer the most sophisticated support, in parenting psychotherapy. For more everyday help, Parents Centres around NZ are really good. Lets support them.

    Parenting of children is undervalued by many people, perhaps most by the familycaught, who are often so blind when it comes to evaluating what parents have to offer their children. These are “money people”, the very last type of people that should have any type of influence in making decisions about the care and protection of children, human or ape.

    With all due respect, I hope that those protesting against CYFs have looked very carefully and objectively at what they are saying. Sometimes perspective requires taking advice from several people, in a position to see.

    Some of the people making public protests just come across as people that probably CYFs should be taking children away from them. When the wider situation is well understood, and the needs of the children clarified, then you have my support.

    About 5 years ago, a NZ lawyer suggested taking a class action against the familycaught. It stalled, due to infighting rather than people getting in with support. The need is still there now. Similarly, maybe there is a case for a class action against CYFs? Certainly, there are quite a few individual actions against CYFs, that are successful through the caughts, even if many also fail.

    Would people work together, or are they all lost in fighting their individual wars?

    Best regards,
    Murray Bacon.

    Comment by MurrayBacon — Sun 25th July 2010 @ 6:33 pm

  21. Infighting…’talking about the devil’.

    Parenting…you can tell people the biggest secret, if they are not ready for it, it will go into one ear and out the other.

    Humbleness…whats humbleness?

    Projections and the shadow…compulsory education for everybody…know thyself.

    Moto GP 9pm

    Comment by Max — Sun 25th July 2010 @ 8:23 pm

  22. That the truth.

    Comment by Darryl X — Wed 4th August 2010 @ 1:24 pm

  23. I am about to face my worst nightmare – CYFS has been mentioned regarding my son.

    I consider fatherhood a privilege – I changed all my son’s nappies for the first two weeks of his life. When he was 11 months I quit my job to look after him, as his mother had discovered she was ‘not maternal’. When he was 2 and a 1/2, she left us )she had been having an affair). For the next 5 years I battled to get her to stick to her schedules for picking him up for their visits etc, while she whined on about having to pay child support. At age 5 he was diagnosed with Asperger Syndrome, a mild form of autism. It requires routine and a lot more work just for the child to feel safe. Then I re-married and all the real trouble started.

    Her jealousy, it appears, knows no limits. She dragged me through the Family Court for two years in an attempt to gain 50-50 shared care (really an attempt to get off child support). I protested to the Judge how painfully transparent the case was, but I still had to agree to more time (she didn’t get 50-50). In order to settle I had to agree to pay her back one week’s child support when she took him for a week in the school holidays – she had previously refused to help in school hols and had been demanding I pay her for it for years.

    Now that she has him more, she winds the poor boy up (easy to do with autism) and provokes him so much that he has become violent towards her at points. Not only does this never happen in my home, it doesn’t happen with my parents or anyone else he is with. Now she is taking him to a Psychologist, who has messed with his head and caused him to distrust his step-mother for no good reason. I have an appointment with the Psych tomorrow morning as she has expressed ‘concern’ and mentioned the Police. When I put my son to bed tonight, he raised the visits with the Psych of his own volition and said the Psych had talked to him about how CYFS can come and take him away if he continues to hit his mother!

    This sort of thing makes me incredibly angry as I have loved my son from birth and sacrificed everything to do my utmost to care for him – this woman could not to begin to understand how deep that goes. And now my poor boy’s future could be in her hands.

    I will stop at nothing to pursue my son’s best interests, so I hope they are ready for battle.

    Comment by jack — Mon 16th August 2010 @ 11:00 pm

  24. My heart goes out to you Jack and to all parents having problems with CYFS.
    Whilst CYFS intend to protect and nurture families they sometimes get it wrong and my comments relate to when they do.
    It is too easy for CYFS to walk into families and destroy them, whilst it is almost impossible to defend your family against vile and quite often untrue accusations made by “concerned citizens” and perpetuated and magnified by CYFS case workers who have no interest in finding out the truth.
    Normal mammalian responses by parents and children are misconstrued by “professionals” to exagerrate the complaint, let me explain.
    CYFS enter you home to uplift your child, what is a natural response?? To get protective, which sometimes results in resistance and anger, CYFS then label you as having anger problems.
    Children, removed from their parents and home they have grown up with, (this in itself is abuse) will become withdrawn and angry, some even become suicidal. These children are labelled as having problems stemming from an abusive home life!
    Things would be different if CYFS were open and honest but once they are part of your life the ABUSE continues.
    There are cases where police involvement has been sought by CYFS, police found no wrong doings, quite the opposite. Yet CYFS refuse to return the children. Expensive court proceedings succeed in ordering that the child is returned, only to have CYFS turn up with several police to uplift the children in an extremely distressing manner. More ABUSE by CYFS.
    There are cases where CYFS has ordered the uplift of babies before they are born, from mothers who themselves have been damaged by CYFS ABUSE!!
    My family has recently been thrust into the CYFS world and I cannot comment on my own case, only that I hope and pray that our child does not end up in the CYFS system, where she will surely suffer from separation anxiety and possible physical, mental and sexual abuse from “Approved Caregivers”
    I have been warned that the Family Group Conference is really a For-Gone Conclusion, there is no requirement of any evidence for the court to order permanent removal of a child and this is WRONG!
    New Zealanders really need to scream st the top of our lungs to STOP this ABUSE by CYFS and to call an immediate commission of enquiry into CYFS practices, as they seem to frequently get it wrong, either by unnecessarily intervening or by not stepping in when thay really should. IMHO some CYFS case workers cannot see the difference between real abuse and imagined or made up abuse by vindictave complainants.
    Oops I have gone on way too long. Sorry.
    PANIC and CYFSwatch are recommended reading for anyone before they call CYFS for “Help” because sometimes they DONT!!
    Jack, please can you post an update on your case.

    Comment by concerned father — Mon 22nd November 2010 @ 1:58 pm

  25. Hey, sorry for the long wait for an update.

    Well it appears the threat of CYFS was just meant to scare him – terrific, they’re resorting to emotional abuse to control the poor boy. My meeting with the Psych was a joke – she asked me to punish him at my home every time he hits his mother, EG Take his X-box away or something (cant even remember when he last touched the thing). I responded that I can’t discipline him for things that happen at his Mum’s as I will never witness them or the events leading up to the hitting – hardly fair. I point blank refused to do it and said I won’t be the ogre. I strongly recommended to her that the real culprit is his mother and she’s the one who needs help. It all came to nothing anyway as she left soon after, and then I had the laborious task of trying to get an official report of her findings, which finally turned up – a one-pager that wasn’t worth the paper its written on.

    My son had his worst year of school ever last year. I put this down to the change of the arrangements to give some school days/nights to his mum (who does the bare minimum of homework), and the messing with his head by the Psych.

    Then a couple of weeks ago she didn’t show up to collect him. When she took me to court no agreement was ever reached regarding the Christmas school hols, so the Judge set the arrangements. The ex didn’t read it properly and so we had to take time off work etc to cover. Didn’t bother calling her as we were only too happy for him not to go. Trouble is, once she became aware of her mistake, she tried to demand that she should have him the following weekend. I said no as it was our weekend, and not our problem she didn’t turn up for her allotted time – her loss. Get this – she said I was in breach of the order and she was calling the Police, I was going to get 3 months in jail yada yada yada. Nobody turned up on my doorstep to haul me away.

    Don’t get me wrong – I’m a nice guy. That’s how I ended up in this position. But once I stopped being a doormat, that’s when all this sh** started flying. So that’s why I never give her an inch any more – she is a bully. Because of the combination of everything mentioned above, I’ve been seeking legal advice again in terms of varying the order. Imagine how low my jaw dropped when I was told she couldn’t really get into any trouble for forgetting to pick him up. I’ve also been told I can’t do anything about her harrassment of me, as the Family Court only care about the interests of the child. When I raised the obvious emotional abuse of my son, they said its too difficult to prove. Basically she needs to hit him for anybody to care (a scary notion – she once stuck a knife in me).

    The lawyer did have one idea I hadn’t considered – asking my son how he felt about going to his mum’s. Now you have to understand, I’ve never done this because I’ve made every effort not to bad-mouth his mother in front of him. But after this was suggested I sat him down and told him everything that’s been going on. Best thing I could’ve done. It was like the penny dropped for him. He said “So Mum’s been threatening you with the Police? She did that to me too!” Suddenly all was becoming clear, and he told me that for the first time in his life he had an idea of how much I really cared about him – a very unexpected outcome (especially with autism) but a very pleasant one.

    So the upshot is there are lawyer’s letters going back and forth currently with a view to going back to her having him every 2nd weekend. I await the response, but I’m sure it won’t be pretty.

    Comment by Jack — Fri 4th March 2011 @ 2:43 am


    Comment by julie — Fri 4th March 2011 @ 9:10 am

  27. If anyone is interested, …. some of us got offline and have a presentation happening in Auckland about Child Protection. I don’t think we are prepared for the can of worms, so to speak that we have opened but all of us who speak are more than happy to take this as far as it has to go. It’s too late I think to go back to moaning online, lol.

    So if you have a case you need to be dealt with, you better come because we don’t have a lawyer, we have a barrister and he wants to take this as far as it goes too. We don’t talk to social workers, we talk to national supervisors. We’ve also connected to groups in the area and other areas.

    CFY leaders are hoping we make a resolution rather than a revolution (their words) so they are backing this. (at the moment we are still in discussion)

    Check single parents link for details.

    We are man and woman friendly. 🙂

    Comment by Julie — Fri 11th March 2011 @ 7:11 pm

  28. After work put into presentations, we were in 2 newspapers and had a good turn out on Sunday. We also had a presentation on Wednesday 16th March (yesterday) and I have a feeling we were being monitored.

    Our petition for an Independent Complaints Authority petition (Graham Axford put it forward some time ago) was presented in Parliament 2pm the very same day…… Fantastic!!!! Wow!!!! Yay!!!!

    I don’t believe this was coincidence but don’t care much either. Bravo to the men who took part.

    Comment by Julie — Thu 17th March 2011 @ 12:17 pm

  29. An interesting case has made a precedent for S59 ‘No Smacking Bill’. See here.

    Also interesting is the responses from child advocates who are very upset.

    Most interesting is the words of the father involved in the case, the head juror and what Family First has put together. See here, …here and here.

    Comment by julie — Wed 23rd March 2011 @ 7:12 pm

  30. Now folks just imagine for a moment if the family court delivered due process by also having a jury and not just some solitary judge.
    We might get real justice there more often instead of misandric/chivalric defathering!
    Wow!they might even prosecute a few of those thousands of falsely accusing women!

    Comment by Skeptik — Wed 23rd March 2011 @ 10:27 pm

  31. Funny you should mention this.

    We might get real justice there more often instead of misandric/chivalric defathering!

    (And demothering) What do you suggest clients who fall into this bracket do? – That is, those who are falsely accused.

    Comment by Julie — Thu 24th March 2011 @ 6:56 am

  32. Julie,
    In all my years of observing social matters I’ve never heard of the ‘family’ ‘court’ doing demothering, only defathering.
    As this is a men’s site I’m focussed on fathers too.

    As for the question of what to do about being falsely accused I have my own personal strategy which is pro-active rather than reactive. By pro-active I mean I don’t put myself in a situation where I am vulnerable to being falsely accused in the first place. I therefore eschew close relationships with women when in a feminist culture.
    Having made that decision I felt some loneliness at first and I grieved.
    However, I got over that a long time ago and it was well worth it.
    I now enjoy the vast freedom from fear which comes with living in a gynocratic gulag (living with a woman under a feminist regime).
    I encourage other men to try it, if only for a few weeks or months to test it out. I’ll bet many would feel as I do after an initial period of feeling strange.

    Comment by Skeptik — Thu 24th March 2011 @ 11:19 am

  33. Thanks Skeptic, I think that’s terrific.

    I am going to add to this thread as the story progresses – for political voice. I’ll also add some helpful links.

    Comment by julie — Thu 24th March 2011 @ 12:55 pm

  34. I’d love to test life outside a “gynocratic gulag”, but that’s not possible in the US. They take your passport away and put you in jail here (I guess you could say that jail is outside “gynocratic”).

    Concerning a comment about “demothering” – in divorce, the number of fathers who lose access to their children (when not just custody is considered but obstacles to relationships with children like child-support are considered too – not to mention parental alienation and other factors) exceeds the number of mothers by a multiple of twenty-eight (that’s 28 times – absolutely staggering). Basically, mothers are not “demothered” because in more than 90% of instances, they retain custody of their children (approximately 85% sole custody and approximately 7% some shared arrangement). Even when fathers have sole custody (which is less than 7% of instances, the mother is not paying any child-support most of the time, which means that a primary mechanism of separating children from their parents (child-support) is not an obstacle for mothers – only fathers. With such a lopsided ratio like that, to even suggest the existence of “demothering” seems inappropriate.

    Comment by Darryl X — Fri 25th March 2011 @ 4:50 am

  35. Darryl,

    I see where you are coming from and when competing for resources, I see these statistics being helpful – Thanks for sharing them.

    I could use them to show children are losing mothers in the family court for as you say, the majority of single parents with children are women and I would put money on single parents being the majority of state child protection service’s clients who use the family court to take children away from parents.

    It’s not unusual for both men and women to make accusations against the other parent’s parenting to state child services when separating and for years on, while new men and women on the scene who are hurt from rejection or jealous of the ex also look to make accusations.

    CYF have to investigate all complaints even when they can tell the person accusing is being revengeful (they tape all complaints). Mothers, like fathers are considered guilty till proven innocent and children lose mothers thus demothering.

    Still, I don’t wish for men to concentrate on women especially on a site focused on men’s experiences.

    Comment by Julie — Sat 26th March 2011 @ 2:13 am

  36. CYF have to investigate all complaints even when they can tell the person accusing is being revengeful (they tape all complaints). Mothers, like fathers are considered guilty till proven innocent and children lose mothers thus demothering

    If only this was true. CYFS refused to get involved when I made 3 complaints of abuse from my x. The fourth time I went throu the Police to get CYFS involved (I am now sorry I bothered to get CYFS involved now). My mother spoke to the CYFS social worker and was told that CYFS had no reason to disbelieve my x. CYFS refuse to listen me.

    My x admitted to CYFS that she used violence on my sister kids but CYFS said she wasnt in trouble.

    CYFS have labeled me as “seriously violent” with no evidence to support this claim. Im over 40 and have no convictions.

    I hope to use the evidence I have to prove her story is false. But in the end, I dont think its going to matter, ill be labeled as an abuser.

    Comment by Jono — Sat 26th March 2011 @ 6:24 am

  37. Jono, the father in the article spent 2 years protesting to get CYF to acknowledge the mother was unfit. He has his daughter 4/5 days a week now and soon full-time.

    CYFS have labeled me as ‘seriously violent’ with no evidence to support this claim. Im over 40 and have no convictions.

    I hear this allot. You wouldn’t happen to be in Auckland? or Tauranga?

    Comment by Julie — Sat 26th March 2011 @ 6:56 am

  38. I hear this allot. You wouldn’t happen to be in Auckland? or Tauranga?

    yes im in west auckland. The CYFS office is Westgate.

    the father in the article spent 2 years protesting to get CYF to acknowledge the mother was unfit. He has his daughter 4/5 days a week now and soon full-time.

    CYFS in my case have been involved for 8 months so im still a “baby” to the system. We did try and split back in 2009, CYFS didnt get involved then. My x couldn’t look after herself and I was in a sense forced to return. We both back then agreed on a 50/50 for our daughter.

    the CYFS report doesnt put my x into good light and I barely get a good mention. I feel CYFS should report fact and take statements from both sides. Even the Police reports had concerns over my x. The x is taking the “xxx made me this way”.

    Are you a support worker or something Julie?

    Until the (fabricated) DV case is heard, I see my daughter twice a week (CYFS wish it to be once a fortnight). There are reports to say my daughter is happier now im back on the scene. There were 6 weeks I was denied access to my daughter.

    Comment by Jono — Sat 26th March 2011 @ 7:42 am

  39. actually I should put fact down.

    CYFS got more active involvement for 8 months. They have been investigating the case for longer (without my knowledge).

    Comment by Jono — Sat 26th March 2011 @ 7:47 am

  40. Too bad that after investigation, anyone who is found to have made false allegations (and let’s face it, they are almost always deliberate) aren’t prosecuted and punished to the extent the victims of their false allegations already have been and would be had they been found guilty. That would discourage a lot of false allegations. It probably wouldn’t discourage many real ones, as real “crimes” like these are extremely rare in the first place.

    Comment by Darryl X — Sat 26th March 2011 @ 7:56 am

  41. Are you a support worker or something Julie?

    I can only answer yes because the ‘something’ covers a few things that I do too.

    I am very fortunate to be part of an awesome team of men (and some women) whose stories will blow your mind, so to speak. How far will fathers go? Oh, it’s immeasurable.:)

    I emailed you but if it doesn’t get through, please contact me so I can put you with this team. Just for the fact you are with them you will see different treatment. It’s really not OK to abuse fathers.

    Oh, this is free of charge. Yeap, it’s true.

    Comment by Julie — Sat 26th March 2011 @ 11:31 am

  42. Well, in NZ victims are allowed to approach judges before they make that conclusion. Did I tell you how a friend of mine says women are no good until after menopause? I remind how men aren’t much better until after women-o-pause, lol.

    Comment by Julie — Sat 26th March 2011 @ 11:34 am

  43. I emailed you but if it doesn’t get through

    Thanks I got your email and replied. I am looking forward to this. Im in a men’s only group on Wednesday nights but another wouldnt go amiss.

    Comment by Jono — Sat 26th March 2011 @ 3:07 pm

  44. Oh, this is free of charge. Yeap, it’s true.

    just noticed on that web site you posted, its free to members. I see there is a West Auckland meeting tomorrow.

    Comment by Jono — Sat 26th March 2011 @ 3:20 pm

  45. Do tell, Jono, what Wednesday group are you with?

    Comment by Julie — Sat 26th March 2011 @ 3:22 pm

  46. just noticed on that web site you posted, its free to members. I see there is a West Auckland meeting tomorrow.

    Haha, Jono. It’s a big thing to be a single parent and you might want to think over whether you want the children taken from her or given to you. I have given you my phone number.

    Comment by Julie — Sat 26th March 2011 @ 3:31 pm

  47. Do tell, Jono, what Wednesday group are you with?

    Father and Child Trust in Onehunga on Wednesday nights.

    Haha, Jono. It’s a big thing to be a single parent and you might want to think over whether you want the children taken from her or given to you.

    quoting from the ANZ ad (I think)

    in a perfect world…..

    we would have 50/50 shared care as in the past and either side got on with the job in hand of bringing up our daughter.

    I guess in a perfect world we wouldn’t have split.

    But we understand the world isn’t perfect….

    but dreams are free.

    Comment by Jono — Sat 26th March 2011 @ 3:59 pm

  48. Do tell, Jono, what Wednesday group are you with?

    Father and Child Trust in Onehunga on Wednesday nights.

    This is a long way to drive. Good for you and good for fatherandchild.

    I haven’t seen an email from you. Did you send one?

    I also wonder if you’ve met Leigh (single father)

    in a perfect world”¦..

    we would have 50/50 shared care as in the past and either side got on with the job in hand of bringing up our daughter.

    This is where many of us want to put effort. A few Auckland men’s advocates contact your ex and yourself to try and help both work something out. The family court also give 6 free counselling sessions for parents to sort out parenting and assets.

    Comment by julie — Sun 27th March 2011 @ 10:53 am

  49. This is a long way to drive. Good for you and good for fatherandchild.

    This was part of the SSU assessment I agreed to continue.

    I haven’t seen an email from you. Did you send one?

    weird.. maybe check your spam? I have just sent another.

    I also wonder if you’ve met Leigh (single father)

    I have replied to this in the email.

    The family court also give 6 free counselling sessions for parents to sort out parenting and assets.

    This is the second time now we have gone through the familycaught. We had our sessions which failed to produce a result (we were living together at that time). They cant tell the difference between Anger and frustration. Lawyers are almost done sorting the assets (CYFS are monitoring this).

    Comment by Jono — Sun 27th March 2011 @ 11:22 am

  50. Oooo Kaaaay, so besides working with leaders and men’s welfare I sat in a meeting (in the backyard of a home) between family and cyf manager….. I got a phone call from CYF after hours asking me to sit with pediatricians 8.30am tomorrow.

    Well…. shit. I did say I am not going to shut up.

    Oh, my, you need to walk the walk before you can judge. I’ll let you know what happens.

    Comment by Julie — Wed 30th March 2011 @ 7:26 pm

  51. Sigh… another day in the Family Court with a biased, man-hating judge. Maybe I should just get myself held in contempt so I can go to jail away from the BS.

    Comment by Jack — Fri 7th December 2012 @ 1:02 pm

  52. #51. KNOW how you feel

    Comment by shafted — Fri 7th December 2012 @ 1:14 pm

  53. Hi all

    Just thought to let you know we had a final hearing before a judge recently (I wrote the posts at #23, #25 and #51). Thankfully we didn’t get the ‘man-hater’ judge I got last time. My son spoke to the Judge himself before the case and said he wanted to stay with me (IE no change to the existing order), and the Judge ruled in favour of his wishes. I know this is not normally the case so I’m just putting it out there in case anyone else in the same situation needs some hope right now. I’m also not naive enough to think all the trouble is over but at least the legal stuff might be. We are celebrating regardless while we can.

    Comment by Jack — Wed 22nd May 2013 @ 2:47 pm

  54. Further to above… I was correct, she attempted to squeeze one last judicial hearing out of the current proceedings. However, my lawyer suggested she withdraw in order to save me some money as this latest conference was a complete waste of time and just sorting out the paperwork… Apparently, a female family court judge in Wellington agreed, because she threw the case out yesterday. Discontinued. Thanks for coming! Relief……

    Comment by Jack — Thu 12th September 2013 @ 1:48 pm

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